Without a change of course, would generals ‘revolt’?

May 14, 2007

When Bush vetoed war funding two weeks ago, he said it was necessary because lawmakers’ withdrawal timeline would mean “American commanders in the middle of a combat zone would have to take fighting directions from politicians 6,000 miles away in Washington, D.C.”

As it turns out, the president might be right about the commanders’ frustration — but wrong about the politician.

Appearing on NBC’s Chris Matthews Show this morning, Atlanta Journal-Constitution columnist Cynthia Tucker revealed that sources within the military are warning of “a revolt from active-duty generals if September rolls around and the president is sticking with the surge into ’08.”

Noting that retired generals such as Gen. John Batiste have already begun voicing their discontent with the president’s strategy in Iraq, Tucker added that the generals “don’t want to fall by the wayside like the generals in Vietnam did, kept pushing a war that they knew was lost.”

I guess Major Gen John Batiste and Army Major General Paul Eaton may soon be part of a much larger trend.

Of course, it’s probably worth remembering that the president has a habit of substituting his judgment for that of the generals in the field, and firing commanders who disagree.

Let’s not forget items like this one from January:

When President Bush goes before the American people tonight to outline his new strategy for Iraq, he will be doing something he has avoided since the invasion of Iraq in March 2003: ordering his top military brass to take action they initially resisted and advised against. […]

It may also be a sign of increasing assertiveness from a commander in chief described by former aides as relatively passive about questioning the advice of his military advisers. In going for more troops, Bush is picking an option that seems to have little favor beyond the White House and a handful of hawks on Capitol Hill and in think tanks who have been promoting the idea almost since the time of the invasion.

And now that the president is pushing the military to the breaking point, there’s talk of a “revolt.” September really ought to be interesting.

“Of course, it’s probably worth remembering that the president has a habit of substituting his judgment for that of the generals in the field, and firing commanders who disagree.”

I would go so far as to say that ‘active duty general who disagrees with the president’ is now an oxymoron.

  • “substituting his judgment for that of the generals in the field, and firing commanders who disagree.”

    Nested puppets
    Puppet generals controlled by a puppet president controlled by Cheney.. so who controls Cheney?.

  • A revolt? What kind of a revolt are we talking about here—boycotting MRE’s for a couple of meals, or a full-fledged rebellion? Maybe a military coup? Tribunals and firing-squads all around?

    Inquiring minds want to know!!!

    (switching the snark button off now….)

  • After so many suggestions of ‘people in positions of power’ revolting against our National Nincompoop, only to be left blowing in the wind when ‘pucker time’ comes ’round, color me skeptical that there will really be a revolt of such magnitude as to make any kind of difference.

  • what terraformer said.

    I’m still waiting for the f***ing Democratic “leadership” to revolt.

  • What would a revolt by active duty generals look like? Would they seize key communications facilities first, or would they simply march into the capitol and declare martial law?

  • What terraformer said. Maybe there’ll be an uptick in resignations, and maybe one or two additional generals will agree to make ads for VoteVets, but this isn’t going to have a political impact.

  • With Apologies to Green Day
    Sung to the Tune of Wake Me Up When September Ends

    The Surge has come and passed
    The momentum would never last
    wake me up when september ends

    like predictions come to pass
    four months will go so fast
    wake me up when september ends

    here comes W again
    firing all the Stars
    drenched in his booze again
    becoming what he is

    as my frustration boils
    and never forget what we lost
    wake me up when september ends

    The Surge has come and passed
    The numbers can never last
    wake me up when september ends

    Kagan’s face on Faux again
    like he did when (the) surge began
    wake me up when september ends

    here comes ole Surge again
    angering all the Stars
    drenched in young blood again
    becoming who we are

    as my cynicism grows
    and won’t forget what was said
    wake me up when september ends

    The Surge has come and passed
    The momentum would never last
    wake me up when september ends

    like predictions come to pass
    four months will go so fast
    wake me up when the revolt begins
    wake me up when the revolt begins
    wake me up when the revolt begins

  • A “generals revolt” could take the form of resignations — along with some nasty parting words. Or it could mean Iraq commanders simply ignoring White House orders and keeping their troops’ heads down.

    It should be kept in mind that following orders is the foundation of every military. Following orders is sacrosanct, and should be. At the same time, high-ranking professionals aren’t blind to strategic reality, and most current generals have direct experience with Vietnam and what it did to the army. They were determined not to repeat it by fighting wars such as the one foisted on them by Bush. But they had to obey orders — or be replaced by someone who would.

    I don’t think most of us are very aware of how much the military hates this war. The service is their career and profession. They are being forced to watch their profession sabotaged by the commander-in-chief (Commander Guy), not an enemy. The army is losing low and mid-level officers in droves. And the backbone of any army — the non-coms — are getting out too.

    They may feel bolder now that Rummy is gone. Gates appears to be more realistic. And I don’t think it’s any secret (as Petraeus well knows) that the primary objective of Commander Boy has become the hunt for a scapegoat.

    It’s hard for most of us to understand the “silence” of high-ranking officers. If we don’t like it, we should remember the noise of MacArthur and Patton, who wanted to expand their wars.

    I remember a friend of my father-in-law, who was a retired Marine aviator. He told me (in 1968) the quiet advice among his fellow officers was a warning to keep his son out of Vietnam because the war was being run so terribly. He said he would do just that. This guy had won the Navy Cross in the Battle of Midway. If he hadn’t been retired, I doubt he would have shared that warning about Vietnam.

  • The best form of rebellion in the military is a public resignation. It is the military version of dousing oneself in gasoline and lighting the fire. These officers live for their profession. To step down must be extremely difficult, done only as a last resort.

  • It’s funny, I’ve had a recurring fantasy of the military getting so fed up with Bush and Cheney that they send squads of MPs to arrest them both in the White House and turn over the government to Nancy Pelosi as the next in line. A bloodless coup that retains civilian control, as it were.

    I don’t know, but it seems like that might not be such a far-fetched scenario now. Things have gotten that desperate.

  • Bu$h may know squat about conducting a war, but he’s a dab hand at conducting an orchestra. Without a rehearsal, too, like everything else he does.
    http://tinyurl.com/2gbnua
    I sure wish he had gone for music, instead of politics…

  • Bush, again is demonstrating no self-awareness of his job description and the powers vested in his office by the Constitution. Ignorance and Stupidity on this level seems to me to be incredibly dangerous. In it’s entire history, the United States has had a Civilian Led Military; Bush has done nothing to lead the military; he initiates conficts between rhetoric and policy (support the troops/Walter Reed), changes the mission in Iraq weekly (Disarm/kill Hussein/establish democracy/quell violence/make oil law/no permanent presence/zillion dollar embassy/massive bases/no exit strategy/support the troops/break the army), and digs his heels in when presented with options that would actually rescue him and get him out of this disaster he has created (Full war funding with redeployment language).

  • ***I, (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.***

    In examining the US Military Oath of Enlistment, there seems to be a quandary here. How does a soldier deal with the conflict of a President who has so openly flaunted the Constitution? And how might the UCMJ deal with that same issue? The last time a group of people chose rebellion of someone nicknamed “Mad George,” they placed themselves at risk of summary execution by hanging for treason.

    Maybe Mr. Jefferson’s commentary about “a little revolution being a good thing every now and again” is coming to fruition….

  • There is, as some have noted, a major problem with the generals not obeying orders…If a revolt actually happened, if they stopped the war on their own, if they went into the White House and arrested the President…We would then be the same as all those banana republics we laugh about… and then next time someone was unhappy with the way thisngs were going? Another revolt…and on and on. We cannot allow that to happen. The generals can resign en mass, but they cannot ignore orders from the C in C no matter how bad. They could sort of slow down maybe but unless the Congress steps in and impeaches him…the generals must do what they are told.
    I do like all the funny comments…in fact I sometimes laugh a lot in reading the comments…you people are really funny…Keeps me from crying about this mess.

  • Check you history and don’t get your hopes up. When the chips are down we will all march to the same drummer. That is how we are made. And it will be a general beating the drum. And as always the El Presidente will have appointed that general.

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