‘That’s not what I asked you’

November 29, 2006

The president held a private reception at the White House shortly after the election for newly-elected members of Congress. Sen.-elect Jim [tag]Webb[/tag] (D-Va.), whose son is a Marine lance corporal serving in Iraq, attended, but had no interest in being phony — Webb skipped the presidential receiving line and declined to have his picture taken with the president.

Bush nevertheless approached Webb at the event. They had an interesting conversation.

“How’s your boy?” [tag]Bush[/tag] asked, referring to Webb’s son, a Marine serving in Iraq.

“I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,” Webb responded, echoing a campaign theme.

“That’s not what I asked you,” Bush said. “How’s your boy?”

“That’s between me and my boy, Mr. President,” Webb said coldly, ending the conversation on the State Floor of the East Wing of the White House.

“That’s not what I asked you“? How about, “I’d like to bring all the troops home, too, and I’m looking forward to the day when I can.” Or maybe, “It has to be tough being the father of a Marine who’s in Iraq right now and I wish you the best.”

But not Mr. Diplomacy. No, Bush used his bizarre sense of charm to pester Webb about the son the president put in harm’s way. A source close to Webb told The Hill that the senator-elect was so angered by the exchange that he was tempted to slug Bush, but obviously restrained himself. Good move.

One thing I don’t quite understand is why so many on the right think Bush acted appropriately and Webb didn’t.

One conservative accused Webb of “classlessness.” Another called Webb “disgusting.” Yet another called Webb a “juvenile Bush hater.”

What am I missing here?

Regardless, Webb is entering the Senate with the kind of no-nonsense attitude that too many in his position lack.

If the exchange with Bush two weeks ago is any indication, Webb won’t be a wallflower, especially when it comes to the war in Iraq. And he won’t stick to a script drafted by top Democrats.

“I’m not particularly interested in having a picture of me and George W. Bush on my wall,” Webb said in an interview yesterday in which he confirmed the exchange between him and Bush. “No offense to the institution of the presidency, and I’m certainly looking forward to working with him and his administration. [But] leaders do some symbolic things to try to convey who they are and what the message is.”

Virginia Gov. Tim Kaine (D) told the WaPo that the first-time officeholder doesn’t have the finesse of most experienced politicians and isn’t a “backslapper.”

“There are no senators who have that everyday anxiety that he has as a dad with a youngster on the front lines. That gives him gravitas and credibility on this issue,” Kaine said. “People in the Senate, I’m sure, will agree with him or disagree with him on issue to issue. But they won’t doubt that he’s coming at it from a real sense of duty.”

I like him already.

What am I missing here?

You’re assuming that these writers are writing as their consciences dictate. You’re missing that these defenders of Bush are GOP in fact are shills who are paid or receive privileges to whitewash every action they are supposed to. After all, didn’t that paragon of virtue, Rush Limbaugh, tell us that after the election that he was tired of “carrying the water” of degenerates? Some people haven’t tired, obviously.

  • Thanks CB.

    I think now is the time to designate Bush, The War President, and call him that every chance we get. The Dems should forgo every publicity event with The War President. They should shun him and not even shake his hand. Maybe finally, finally the bubble will burst.

  • The Bush admin is so much like the Wesley Mouch administration in Atlas Shrugged. Bullies demanding respect they haven’t earned.

  • Bush is really a repulsive human being. That’s it. I don’t blame Webb for not saying this–but I wish someone had asked The Deciderer how he’d feel if his daughters were over there.

    Of course, that presumes he genuinely cares about them, and the man is such a narcissist that I’m not at all sure this is the case.

  • What petty reckless disregard for the sacrifice of others. As if Mr. Webb’s perspective as senator-elect should prohibit his perspective as a parent. Sickening–really. I wonder how Americans would have reacted to the President being slugged for such an asinine remark. I’d say he had it coming.

  • Unlike reflexive wingnuts, I will try to be objective here. Assuming the Dauphin asked the original question politely (we are not in a position to know the tenor of the initial exchange), it can be reasonably argued that Webb’s response was impolitic (or, if you prefer very political). But Bush should then have responded with the type of vague generalties you suggest. Instead, his response demonstrated his lifelong sense of arrogant entitlement. Has there ever been a more mean spirited President (other than, perhaps, Nixon)?

  • Where do I sign up for the “2008 Webb is Great” presidential campaign? Just kidding, but it is so refreshing to hear someone stand up in person to the “great and powerful OZ”.

  • It is suddenly so much nicer living in Virginia 😉

    Come two years from now, hopefully Mark Warner will have whipped Jim Gilmore’s ass and we will have become part of America again.

    If Boy George II really believed that the war with al Qaeda was as important as his rhetoric makes it sound, Jenna and Barbara would be in uniform. With the lowered standards for recruits they probably would even be able to get in.

  • Webb did fine, but if I was him I would have said “My son is fine, no thanks to you. The American people have spoken, loud and clear. They want all the American servicemen to come home from your immoral war, and if you don’t listen to the American people your place in history will be even worse than it already is.”

    Webb is gonna kick Bush’s candy ass. He knows the stakes, and has the balls to do it.

  • When I was in the Army we were told we were respecting rank, not the individual. As Bush goes to show, a lot of people with rank are pretty rank.

  • I find it very refreshing, too. A reality-based senator guided by an active conscience. I may not always agree with him, but I have no doubt he will have my respect.

  • CB writes: “One thing I don’t quite understand is why so many on the right think Bush acted appropriately and Webb didn’t.”

    Aside from the water carriers, people believe the office of the presidency deserves respect and deference, no matter what. I disagree. A newly elected president deserves respect and the benefit of doubt until he proves he doesn’t deserve it. For the Regal Moron, that point passed long ago. Respect, when it isn’t due, just confirms his sense of entitlement, validates Regal Moronism and perpetuates Bubblism. Three cheers for Webb. Any smack in the face reality gives Dear Leader is a righteous blow for democracy.

  • You have it slightly wrong; I did not call Mr Webb disgusting, but was referring to his conduct, which I did find disgusting.

    Mr Webb accepted an invitation from the President to a reception at the White House. If he didn’t wish to be seen with or photographed with or polite to President Bush, why did he attend in the first place? He’s a free man, and it was his choice to attend.

    You wrote: “Bush used his bizarre sense of charm to pester Webb about the son the president put in harm’s way.”

    Isn’t Mr Webb’s son a volunteer? Yes, of course he is.

  • “He’s fine, for being in a shitty war started by you to appease your delusional fantasy of a holy crusade to prove your a better president than your daddy. But hey, at least he’s not making so much of an ass of himself in Argentina that he gets asked to leave by the US embassy.”

  • One thing I don’t quite understand is why so many on the right think Bush acted appropriately and Webb didn’t.

    Hey, CB, it’s a lot of hard work, doing the elaborate dance of getting ready to admit we have to pull out of Iraq while at the same time trying not to look like a total idiot.

    Obviously Bush thinks Kaine raised his son roping steer on a ranch just across the way from his own and that he’s known them both for quite a long time. It’s hard to give up he fantasy when you’re someone who buys himself a dude ranch, I guess!

  • One thing I don’t quite understand is why so many on the right think Bush acted appropriately and Webb didn’t.

    Because the Right believes that those with a stake in an issue — war parents, disease sufferers, or crime victims — invite criticism. At least, they believe that the Left tries to insulate itself from criticism by using such people as spokespersons. The Right must necessarily hold the inverse view.

    It’s so easy to think like Colbert these days.

  • “How’s your boy?” Bush asked, referring to Webb’s son, a Marine serving in Iraq.

    “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President,” Webb responded, echoing a campaign theme.

    “That’s not what I asked you,” Bush said. “How’s your boy?”
    .

    The first two parts of the conversation aren’t rude. It got rude when Bush said, “That’s not what I ask you.” Would anyone as an adult to adult not consider that rude?

  • Dana–

    A couple of things:

    1) Having a volunteer military doesn’t mean that they can cavalierly be thrown in harm’s way with impunity. If a national leader is going to ask someone, volunteer or conscript, to put his or her life on the line, that national leader had better have a good reason and a good plan. Our national leader demonstrably has neither.

    2) One of the Left’s complaints against the president is that he keeps himself in a criticism-free bubble. Senator-to-be Webb ran on two issues– the war and income inequity. The president engaged Webb on one of those subjects. Webb would not have been true to his principles to have kept the conversation on the small-talk level and not have taken advantage of being inside the bubble.

  • Give Webb credit for not choking that smug little prick. Perhaps a good response would be:

    – How is my son doing? Not as well as your daughters.

    -Not as well as Halliburton.

    -Not as well as Cheney’s stock portfolio.

    -My son is hoping to make it out of your bungled folly alive, YOU FUCKING MORON!!!

    -WHAMMO! BIFF! KAPOW!…….choke choke…..my son is doing better than you.

    -He’s enjoying it less than you enjoyed your time in the Guard.

  • “That’s not what I asked you”???

    My first thought upon reading that phrase (before reading the article) was that that is a question I’ve been wanting reporters to ask *Bush* (continuously) after he has evaded answering the questions they have posed over the last six years. I suppose Bush has been drilled with “If you don’t want to answer the question, don’t. Dance around it, make a (stupid) joke, change the subject, use one of our many sound bites” by his handlers. So “That’s not what I asked you” would be on his mind.

    I have been very impressed with Jim Webb since seeing him give his victory speech and and in his appearance on Meet the Press. The man admits to being an intellectual. Wow, how unexpected and refreshing is that? He speaks of economic injustice in our society and how that needs to be fixed. Wow again. This guy is going to add a ton of humanity, brains, and perspective to the Senate. In comparison to the current holder of his future office, what a nice change!

  • Maybe at the next press conference the President holds, the reporters should chant in unison “That’s not what I asked you” when the President does not answer their questions.

    Given this and his father’s nearly teary defense of W, I think Bush 43 is beginning to realize that many many people, not just foreigners, hold him in complete contempt.

  • If right-wingers are going to say that no democrats should speak to the president anymore, or attend traditional functions at which the president attends (like a reception for newly elected members of congress) then they should remember their words about respecting the office even if you don’t respect the man.

    It’s perfectly consistent for the guy to want to attend something that congressmen traditionally attend, even if he doesn’t like the decision the president made again and again on Iraq, but still feel that it’s too ridiculous to have to go on a receiving line for someone who makes a decision that effects hs son so personally.

    And his son volunteered to be a soldier, not to be a slave. Webb hasn’t lost his right to complain that soldiers shouldn’t be used for something stupid, especially when his son is a soldier.

  • ml – awesome suggestion about the press conferences.

    It says a lot about Jim Webb that his first thoughts in response to to a very cavalier question was to wish for the safe return of his son, and others fighting with him, from a war zone. Webb wasn’t thinking about making politically pleasant small talk but he expressed a concern for others. Webb’s son is a lance corporal — a rank in the marines that have suffered very, very high casualty rates. Webb has every reason to fear for his son’s life. The fact that W’s response is to not acknowledge Webb’s grave concern’s, not only for his son’s life but for all other servicepeople in Iraq, proves that for W it’s all about politics and having it his way. Life is hell outside of the bubble, isn’t it George?

  • “That’s not what I asked you”???
    My first thought upon reading that phrase (before reading the article) was that that is a question I’ve been wanting reporters to ask *Bush* (continuously)
    Comment by Hannah

    Me too, Hannah. Good point.

  • I have one short, simple question for Dana: Why is it that Democrats are supposed to be deferential to the office of the President when it is occupied by a republican, when the reverse never seems to apply?
    There’s a pattern here that goes back to Nixon – if not beyond.

    As for this incident, it was Bush who acted vulgar and disgusting. Any sane parent’s first wish would be for their child to return home from a war – regardless of their support for said war. Anyone with an ounce of empathy understands this. As CB noted, Bush could have responded in any number of polite and thoughtful ways. Instead, he chose to be confrontational with someone, who unlike anyone else in this administration, has a child in harm’s way. Your sense of ‘disgust’ truly baffles me.

  • Oh how I wait for the day when Webb finds Bush on the floor of the Senate and beats the smug piece of crap like his daddy should have long ago–and in the one place on the planet where Webb couldn’t be prosecuted for the act.

    I have to think that Webb’s son will be dead in a week, though, sent into some hot spot deliberately as bit of payback

  • ***I suspect Webb wanted to punch Bush even before the conversation.***
    ———Dale

    Well gosh—don’t we all?

    Well, maybe not “all.” There are those of course, who lean toward the lowest common denominator of “regal-centric” discourse; practicing the “common cents” mentality of Reich-esque, penny-ante “political thought” with the frumpish fiction of “my president right or wrong.”

    Personally, I’d have jack-hammered the brush-clearing son-of-a-bitch square in the schnozz, and while he was on his knees holding a well-bloodied nose, I’d have gotten in a few swift kicks to the filthy little beast’s gut before being dragged forcefully from the scene of “Justice Served.”

    Senator Webb’s son—as are tens of thousands of other sons, daughters, fathers, uncles, cousins, neighbors, friends, and other such members of the American Family—is in Harm’s Way solely and exclusively because of the deceitful, arrogant, profiteer-based fairy-tales of George W. Bush and his administration. I’d say that Bush gets off “mighty easy” if all he gets out of it is a multitude of “righteously-robust pummelings….”

  • To President Bush, alpha-dog assertions are apparently more important than genuine concern for the sacrifices families make during times of war. Why else would Bush pointedly seek out Webb at this reception, even after Webb had made it obvious that he wanted nothing to do with the President’s gestures? That’s because the President isn’t so interested in back-slapping as much as he is in keeping his rivals in check. I’d be surprised if the President didn’t offer his hand at the receiving line for the fresh meat to kiss.

    I think this exchange brilliantly illustrates how boyishly entitled Bush really is, and that it will be enshrined among other great moments in senate history, like LBJ’s “treatment” of Theodore Green, and Charles Sumner’s beating with a cane.

  • In this case, honesty and candor trump respect and diplomacy. Hanoi George deliberately started a foolish, dangerous, expensive war. Outside the bubble, Americans and Iraqis are being slaughtered for no good reason. Bush Chose to approach Webb and ask a personal question. He got a personal answer.

  • One more proof that ears on someone don’t guarantee a brain between them!
    What we have there are the wages of unthink! A faith-based Uncivil war led by religious malicias… or is it milicias? These malicious milicias are “opposed” by faith-based “strategists” in the White House who never heard a bullet near their ear . Duhhh!

  • Aside from the water carriers, people believe the office of the presidency deserves respect and deference, no matter what.

    People like the Republican’ts in the ’90s when they went on the Great Clenis Hunt? Lots of respect for the office there…

    People like Strom Thurmon, who said (paraphrased, can’t find the original quote) that Clinton should avoid South Carolina if he wants to stay alive? Funny how Republican’ts threatening Democratic presidents don’t go to jail for stuff like that…

    And really funny how Republican’ts believe that the office of the presidency deserves respect and deference. As long as it’s a Republican’t that’s in office…

  • “People like Strom Thurmon, who said (paraphrased, can’t find the original quote) that Clinton should avoid South Carolina if he wants to stay alive? Funny how Republican’ts threatening Democratic presidents don’t go to jail for stuff like that…” – Tom

    I think you can’t find it because that was Jessie Helms saying Clinton should not visit any military bases in North Carolina.

  • Just as a note, I know people who lived in Fort Bragg during the Clinton administration and I don’t think any of them appreciated the slander that they would assasinate their President just because Helms did not like him.

  • After having read so many comments regarding the wordplay between Bush and Webb it has occurred to me that the president seemed to be goading Senator Webb by bringing up the issue of Webb’s son being a Marine and being in grave danger in Iraq. It seems likely that Webb had previous knowledge that the president was very contemptuous of Webb’s platform against the Iraq war and wanted to needle him. This fits the presidents personality to a tee. For this reason, among many others, Webb and all Americans have the right to qualify their “respect for the office of president” until the office is filled by one deserving such respect.

  • When the Cretin of Crawford was a youngster sticking fire crackers up the asses of helpless frogs and blowing them up, I’m pretty sure his smart mouth was writing checks his fists couldn’t cash. His google eyed bitch of a mother was probably spending a lot of time in the principals office wondering why her Little Georgie was coming home from school on a regular basis bloodied up from daily ass kickings.

  • Angry Young Man,

    Oh how I wait for the day when Webb finds Bush on the floor of the Senate and beats the smug piece of crap

    I don’t think W will risk showing up in the Senate, but Cheney on the other hand may just have to. I’m not a violent person, but the vision of Webb thrashing Cheney in the Senate is quite compelling. the phrase “wipe that smirk off his face” comes to mind…

  • Virginia Gov. Tim Kaine (D) told the WaPo that the first-time officeholder doesn’t have the finesse of most experienced politicians — CB

    Man who “doesn’t do nuance” — meet man who “doesn’t have the finesse” (and doesn’t care for B.S. or B…S…, either)……

    I read that article last night and I thought I’d *burst* with pride in Webb; it’s an enormous satisfaction to be one of the Virginians who voted for him. We had a “Dem hens” (volunteers) lunch today and someone brought the printout of the article to circulate around the table — to a lot of appreciative cackling 🙂

    “What am I missing here?” — CB
    My guess would be this:
    The Chimperor, in his graciousness, *made an effort*. He approached Webb, Southerner-to-Southerner, letting the political bygones be bygones, and got snapped at in response. The question itself wasn’t supposed to be answered seriously — it was as meaningless as the “how’re you doing?” asked at a party, or “have a nice day” uttered by a store clerk — Webb was supposed to have said “fine, thank you, sir”, at which point the Chimperor would have felt free to move on, with a glow of a job well-done (heck, he *remembered* to do as he was told, looked Webb up, and asked a humane and friendly question, didn’t he? Who’s the clever boy, now?). And Webb should have felt honored.

    But, instead of the expected “do-si-do” figure in a familiar dance, Mr B got his face chewed off (metaphorically speaking). The Chimperor “doesn’t do spontaneous” any more than he “does nuance”, so he flipped. And, not having much military experience, he didn’t realize it was unwise to mess with the Marines

    IOW, B.S. thought he was in the middle of a strictly social occasion (like his meeting with Maliki in Amman would have been, had it happened — love that one) but got surprised by the sudden change of scene. To many Southerners, “good manners” — however false and hypocritical — trump honesty *every time*.

    Dana, @14
    “Mr Webb accepted an invitation from the President to a reception at the White House. If he didn’t wish to be seen with or photographed with or polite to President Bush, why did he attend in the first place?”

    It wasn’t a *personal* invitation to a little cozy tete-a-tete over a plate of caviar; I have no doubt Webb would have turned that down. It was something all congress-critters were invited to and, being so, it was sensible for a newcomer to attend and meet as many future co-workers as possible.

    And, from the same source:
    “Isn’t Mr Webb’s son a volunteer? Yes, of course he is.”

    There’s no “of course” about it.

    Jimmy is a graduate of a military academy, as his father before him had been. Thus, he has volunteered to serve *the nation* not a whim of a crackpot. And, he volunteered long ago — before the Burning Shrub lost his cotton-pickin’ mind. The only volunteers now in Iraq are those who joined *after* the invasion, and, even then, you can’t really call them volunteers, since many of them got suckered into joining by lies and then were kept in and constantly re-rotated against their will and contrary to what they were promised when they signed…

    Webb may lack Southern manners; *you* lack any sense of compassion or shame not to mention common sense. As such, your behavior is much more disgusting than Webb’s could ever be.

  • Webb is so rude.
    I REALLY WONDER WHY WEBB EVEN BOTHERED TO GO TO THE WHITE HOUSE if he has such contempt for Bush—please–he is such a rude-SOB and I do not mean Senate Office Building.
    Webb is the most ego driven politician to hit the stage in a long time…he is a power hungry hound dog and will not serve the Commonwealth well….it is just a shame…

  • i have never seen so many leftist hate comments in my life! the tolerant,compassionate left who care about our soldiers and hate war…barf! what a bunch of phoneys you all are. what was meane as a simple nicety could have been answered “fine, thank you” had to be made into a political “bring our soldiers home” comment. i don’t blame bush for losing his patience. try to be nice to the guy and he acts like a buffoon. bush could have been nicer but so could webb have been. webb wanted to put the president in a spot, it didn’t work so well so he wanted to slug bush. how nice. how civil. well ain’t he the big man?

  • “the tolerant,compassionate left who care about our soldiers and hate war”

    Yes, once again those damn Christian values that I was raised up believing bubble to the surface.

    Not sayin’ anything, just sayni’

    And having your son overseas in an environment that’s spiraling out of control would probably make any sane parent say “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President.”

  • Given the comments here that people are fantacising that Webb should have said, it’s not surprizing that they don’t find him rude. Apparently – “he’s Bush and evil, and I’m right, so I can say what I want, and plenty of leftists will agree with me.”

    Of course Webb’s first comment was rude. It wasn’t fanatic, screaming hysterical, but it was intentionally cold, refusing a polite gesture in favor of arguing. Did he think W was unaware of his views on the war? Of course not. From the account above, it appears that Webb went to the affair looking for an opportunity to show his displeasure. Some might think that a justified rudeness, because of the importance of the war, but it was rude, nonetheless.

    Bush was entirely accurate – though also cold – when he pointed out that wasn’t what he had asked. Webb then escalated into extreme rudeness.

    The fantasy that the administration is isolated from criticism and it’s a great day when some lone, courageous soul finally corners him with evidence that people disagree with him is simply childish. Just because people don’t do what you want doesn’t mean they haven’t heard you. I have bookmarked this thread under my “proofs” section when I want to illustrate leftist self-righteousness. That most here are unable to apprehend that doesn’t change it.

  • “the tolerant,compassionate left who care about our soldiers and hate war”
    Yes, once again those damn Christian values that I was raised up believing bubble to the surface.
    Not sayin’ anything, just sayni’
    And having your son overseas in an environment that’s spiraling out of control would probably make any sane parent say “I’d like to get them out of Iraq, Mr. President.”

    i was being facetious. the point is that i do not see these traits in any of these postings. the left is vicious and mean. another remark about “if bush cared so much…jenna and barbara would be in uniform”..tells me people on the left don’t get it. our soldiers are VOLUNTEERS. THEY WANT TO FIGHT. NO ONE HAS BEEN FORCED TO GO. and we will win notwithstanding the inability of some people who sacrifice nothing to sit down and shut up and continue to enjoy the freedom to whine that has been given them by these men. if the overwhelming number of soldiers AND THEIR FAMILIES are up for the fight and are willing to sacrifice then who are you to whine and complain? our history is replete with instances just like the one we’re in. we lost 19,000 men in 3 days in the battle of the bulge in wwii. AND WE WON THE WAR. our soldiers have counted the cost. now stop the whining.

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