GOP leaders admit they ‘lose’ the Iraq debate if they stick to the issue

The resolution the House is debating this week is surprisingly straightforward; House Dems even managed to keep the whole thing to just 58 words. Point #1 says we support the troops; point #2 says Congress “disapproves” of Bush’s escalation strategy.

And yet, listening to this week’s debate, it seems as if most of the Republican caucus wants to ignore the resolution and debate something else. As it turns out, that’s a deliberate strategy.

So this explains a lot. House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer’s office has obtained a letter that GOP Reps. John Shadegg and Peter Hoekstra sent out to House GOP colleagues about escalation. The letter gives GOP members pointers on how they should approach the battle over it on the House floor this week.

Hoyer’s office has now posted the letter on his Web site (.pdf), and it lays bare the GOP’s strategy for dealing with debate over the House’s anti-escalation resolution and reveals just how worried party leaders are about having a genuine discussion about the “surge.”

It sure does. “The debate should not be about the surge or its details,” Shadegg and Hoekstra told the GOP caucus. “This debate should not even be about the Iraq war to date, mistakes that have been made, or whether we can, or cannot, win militarily. If we let Democrats force us into a debate on the surge or the current situation in Iraq, we lose.”

It’s an unusually helpful admission. The resolution is about whether the escalation is a good policy, a matter which Republicans should be prepared to debate on its merits. But they’ve come to realize that substantive discussion of the issue at hand is a loser for them.

We could have told them that a long time ago. Come to think of it, I think we did.

So, if Republicans don’t like the resolution but are too scared to debate it, what do they want to talk about? According to the strategy memo from Shadegg and Hoekstra, “the debate must be about the global threat of the radical Islamic movement.”

Maybe the House can have that debate next. After all, the facts aren’t on their side when it comes to the global threat, either.

I’d love it if Dems could make the GOP a deal: drop the nonsense and debate the Iraq resolution on the merits, and then the House can have another debate on the administration’s broader national security goals. Given what we know, Republicans are on the wrong side of both.

For what it’s worth, the Majority Leader’s office has the Shadegg and Hoekstra strategy memo posted as a .pdf, but for those of you who can’t open .pdf documents, and for those who want to be able to copy and paste from the document itself, I went ahead and transcribed the whole thing. It’s worth reading, if for no other reason, to see how scared GOP leaders are of a serious debate on the subject at hand.

* * * * *

Iraq Resolution Debate
Their Terms or Ours?
February 13, 2007

We are writing to urge you not to debate the Democratic Iraq resolution on their terms, but rather on ours.

Democrats want to force us to focus on defending the surge, making the case that it will work and explaining why the President’s new Iraq policy is different from prior efforts and therefore justified.

We urge you to instead broaden the debate to the threat posed to Americans, the world, and all “un-believers” by radical Islamists. We would further urge you to join us in educating the American people about the views of radical Islamists and the consequences of not defeating radical Islam in Iraq.

The debate should not be about the surge or its details. This debate should not even be about the Iraq war to date, mistakes that have been made, or whether we can, or cannot, win militarily. If we let the Democrats force us into a debate on the surge, or the current situation in Iraq, we lose.

Rather, the debate must be about the global threat of the radical Islamist movement. No radical Islamist leader, including Osama bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahari, and Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, has ever claimed that the goal of radical Islam is Iraq alone or if they succeed in Iraq this war against us would end. In fact, Robert Kagen recently wrote a piece for the Washington Post entitled “Grand Delusion” noting many politicians’ desire to wish the war away. He notes that those who call for an end to the war don’t want to talk about the fact that the war in Iraq and in the region will not end, but will only grow more dangerous if and when we walk away.

Thanks to the liberal mainstream media, Americans fully understand the consequences of continuing our efforts in Iraq — both in American lives and dollars. The American people do not understand the consequences of abandoning that effort or the extreme views, goals, and intentions of the radical Islamist movement that is fueling the war in Iraq and the attacks on westerners and unbelievers throughout the world.

The attached map and list of some of the attacks worldwide since 2002 illustrates the global nature of this threat.

Join us in asking our Democratic colleagues the essential question: If we do not defeat radical Islam in Iraq, then where will we do so?

We will send further information in the coming days. However, should your staff require further details, please have them contact Eric V. Schlecht at 5-3361 to get these insightful books: “Knowing the Enemy” by Mary Habeck and “America Alone” by Mark Steyn.

Sincerely,
John Shadegg
Pete Hoekstra

“Thanks to the liberal mainstream media, Americans fully understand the consequences of continuing our efforts in Iraq — both in American lives and dollars.”

1) they actually refer to the liberal msm in internal party documents?
2) what does this even mean? Are they really thanking the media for informaing the people? Do they mean the consequences of staying are positive (fightin’ them over there) or negative (dead Americans)?

I assume we will see this all over the Sunday Morning shows this week, right? Lots of questions to the GOP leaders about why they feel it necessary to derail debate about the war by bringing up the threat from Islamofacism, which we all know is not really related to Iraq at all.

Probably not…

  • “2) what does this even mean?”

    I read it to mean that they are pissed that the “liberal mainstream media” has told the truth/shown the true picture of what is happening in Iraq. That they wish all media was like Faux Noise and Rush Dimbulb who blatantly lie to their listeners/viewers and keep them in a blissfully ignorant state regarding what is actually happening in the world.

  • For what was intended as an internal memo, this suggests that the congressional GOP is even more out of touch with reality than I would have thought. It’s clear that they and the Bush Crime Family are down. It’s time to begin kicking them in the ribs. Very hard.

  • Evidently House GOP members want to waste their five minutes at the podium talking about anything but the escalation of the Iraq debacle. But weren’t they insisting this is the only valid strategy from the moment Bush told House leaders about it? Now they say they can’t defend it in open, on-the-record debate?

    What a bunch of reichwing pussies.

  • Yes, anytime the truth and factual information is brought out, they lose. Stomp on the cockroaches. Smash them to hell. Drive a wooden stake through the hearts of the larger ones.

  • TO:

    The Rep. Hackstra or Rep. Shagged staffer who leaked the hilarious memo:

    Dear Anonymous staffer. We carpetbaggers love you. Happy Valentine’s Day! (P.S. Keep leaking)

  • CB I think you have a typo here.

    ” Senate Majority Leader Steny Hoyer’s ”

    It should be House Majority Leader.

    As for the actual article. No shit. The Iraq War was a marketing campaign of little substance. They can point to 50 semi to non existant reasons to why they invaded. Now that they realized Iraq is a big shit sandwich, they’re trying to change the subject before they have to take a very big bite of it.

    The Rogers and Jacks of the GOP are upset that the Ralphs, Simons and Piggys of the world are striking back. Twist the fucking knife on these ignorant fuckers.

  • all of this seems standard parliamentary maneuver stuff – I’m sure there are some issues out there that Pelosi/Hoyer would use the same sort of tactics and we would applaud them.

    But having said that – will the MSM merely treat uncriticaly this as a “he said, she said” without bothering to point out that what the GOP side said has nothing to do with Iraq – or will they give them the pass – as usual.

  • FIRST: We are not fighting near as many Islamic Fundamentalists as Iraqi Nationalists and Pissed Off Sunni Baathists.

    SECOND: The Islamic Fundamentalists who are actively plotting against us are in Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia and are being funded with Saudi money.

  • With the arguments they use, the Republicans are bound to lose.
    On an off the floors of Congress, Republicans make at least 2 claims that make no sense.

    “If we don’t succeed over there, the terrorists will attack us over here.” Do they really believe that terrorists are waiting for some Iraq outcome before trying to hurt us here? If we “win” in Iraq, can we then let our guard down?

    “If we fail in Iraq, Al Qaeda will be established in Iraq.” Putting aside the fact that our invasion first brought some Al Qaeda to Iraq, we have little to fear if more are present. If they come, let them deal with the civil war there. And what will they gain in Iraq, use of all the nukes and other WMD that are there?

    Republicans also claim that end the war resolutions undermine the morale of the troops. I doubt that most soldiers are affected greatly by Wahington politics. And if you ask them if they would like to see the end of the occupation and come home, guess what they would say.

    Homer http://www.altara.blogspot.com

  • “We urge you to instead broaden the debate to the threat posed to Americans, the world, and all “un-believers” by radical Islamists.”

    Replace “Americans” with “Christedom”. Let the Holy Crusade continue!

    And “un-believers”? Who else in the world uses that term……?

  • Note to the Troops: This is all about Republican congressmen getting reelected, it is not about the health & safety of the troops or the “success” of the mission.

    When will the rest of the troops realize that the current incarnation of the Republican party fundamentally disrespects them? They are willing to use and abuse them, then discard them when it is politically expedient.

  • I heard Rep Boner (yeah, that’s the wat it should be said) say if we leave Iraq, the terrorists will “follow us home.”
    Sound like he was scared by some stray puppy when he was a kid.

  • “If we do not defeat radical Islam in Iraq, then where will we do so?”

    Are you kidding me? That’s like some mullah saying, “If we don’t defeat Christianity in New York City, where will we defeat them?” An idea or religion is not defeated in a place. And this is basically the linchpin of their argument of focusing not on a surge but on a belief system. This just proves Republicans don’t get the war, but they do get games playing in Congress on our dime.

  • hey, this is great – it appears everyone agrees that the surge is not defensible and is a “loser” on the merits. So surely there will be no surge, right?

    Um, right?

    [crickets chirping]

  • The very idea that terrorists will “follow us home” is fearmongering balderdash! Terrorists are alive and well already here in the good ol’USofA. We just call them by different terms: serial killers, estranged husbands, jilted lovers, disgruntled employees, astronauts driving 900 miles in diapers, and the like. We witness, daily, crimes committed here in America out of hate, bigotry, and fear of otherness. So, I say any rhetoric spewed toward me of the likes spewed by Rep. Hoekstra et al. is the hogwash it is. I wish these Republican lawmakers truly cared about our troops. Instead, they continue to play politics with our nation’s fine men and women in uniform. -Kevo

  • This is great. Let the Repubs skirt the issue and everytime they do, read this memo into the record again. Chide them for hiding their heads in the sand.

    Strike a deal to’ll talk about terrorism right after the Iraq resolution passes. Then bring out the new terrorism assessment prepared by The Center for American Progress and Foreign Policy that just came out. Nail these SOBs to their own issues.

  • ‘The attached map and list of some of the attacks worldwide since 2002 illustrates the global nature of this threat.’

    It may be interesting to see a comparable map for 1997-2002 (or even further back) and maybe make some inferences on how the war on Iraq has influenced the patterns.

  • What peterado said in #14, and Simple in #9.

    This is desperate rhetoric, from a party that smells its looming demise. The rationale for The Big Republican Quagmire has shifted yet again… Now we’re not just there to spread democracy (as if that was possible)… Now we’re there to “defeat radical Islam”.

    We went from trying to whack Osama and his gang to trying to “defeat radical Islam”. (whatever the hell that means!)

    Let’s see a poll on how many Americans think that “defeating radical Islam” is our job, is even possible, or is a good way to spend our time, energy, money, and blood. Don’t forget that once you “defeat radical Islam” in Iraq (assuming that we could) then you have Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Somalia, and dozens of other countries where “radical Islamists” hang out sometimes.

    Before we invaded, “radical Islam” wasn’t a problem in Iraq, and now it is (according to these geniuses), so I guess we’ll need to invade any country that might ever become a problem too.

    I would ask any Republican these questions: How do you know when you have “defeated radical Islam”? How many more soldiers will we need to do that? How long will that take, and how much will it cost? Most importantly, what exactly are you willing to do to raise the money and manpower for this crusade? Are you willing to stop buying oil from Saudi Arabia, the biggest source of radical Islamist extremism?

  • kevo is right in #16, but he misses the professional killers… Corporations.

    Tobacco companies kill almost half a million Americans annually, and chemical manufacturers probably are killing even more of us. Industrialized “food” kills us in droves. Coal fired powerplants kill us by the thousands. The fossil-fuel industry will literally kill billions of us.

    These terrorists make Osama binLaden look like an amateur, and they do it for financial gain.

  • Has anyone ever played a computer war game? If you have you know that one of the basic is if you have a larger force, you win more quickly. This of course is not a computer game, real guys are getting maimed and killed. If the General in Iraq wants the troops, let him have them. What is really behind all of this “debate”? Grand standing by the Dems. What is the Dem’s strategy for winning this war? Apposing what ever Bush and the Generals want to do? Funny that is what the terrorist want as well.

  • Join us in asking our Democratic colleagues the essential question: If we do not defeat radical Islam in Iraq, then where will we do so?

    NO, idiots, that is NOT the question that should be asked. The question should be, “HOW will we defeat radical Islam worldwide?”

    I can guarantee you the answer is NOT: kill them all. Killing the radical Islamists is like stomping on cockroaches. You can’t stomp ’em all.

    The answer, as always, lies in the economics of the Middle East. Develop the economies in that part of the world, focus on education and give them a stake in bettering their own lives. End of transmission.

  • Moon,

    Welcome troll. If you ever played a computer war game, then you know that the larger force wins when it is fighting a similar conventional force. Unfortunately in Iraq, the bad guys dress like civilians, hide among them and only “engage” through remote rocket attacks and roadside bombs.

    What is the admin’s startegy for winning this war?? Supply a smaller force for the first 4 years, then put in a bigger force that can ‘win’???
    Go read a book about Viet Nam and tell us how that one went.

  • Moonie asks
    “Has anyone ever played a computer war game?”

    Plenty of them. I played enough to know that no computer game has ever been able to deal with unconventional warfare as there is no series of mathematical formulae (the basis of all computer war games) that can deal with all the variables. It isn’t just a matter of blowing shit up and zapping bad guys.

    As Gridlock pointed out, how do explain Rummy’s original warplan for Iraq of 75K troops with no armor/artillery and only air support?

  • Ed said: It’s clear that they and the Bush Crime Family are down. It’s time to begin kicking them in the ribs. Very hard.

    Nah, once they’re down, aim for the head, the chest, and between the legs. When they get up – if they get up – they’ll never be the same. Sharp-toed cowboy boots or steel-toed construction boots are highly recommended.

    Having survived an attack like that by doing what we were taught in the civil rights movement (curl in a ball), I know this will work with Republicans, since they’re too stupid to know what to do.

    “The only ‘good Republicans’ are pushing up daisies.”

  • Moon (#21) What is really behind all of this “debate”? Grand standing by the Dems. What is the Dem’s strategy for winning this war? Apposing what ever Bush and the Generals want to do? Funny that is what the terrorist want as well.

    Typical winger – too fucking ignorant to be able to use the English language as regards sentence structure and spelling.

    How long did mommy home school you, Moon? Does she know what you’re doing with that computer down in the basement? When are you going to join up to fight the International War Against Non-Christians? Sorry, I forgot – hard up as they are, the Army has a policy against enlisting psychopaths. You lose (as you always have)

  • “Funny that is what the terrorist want as well. ”

    If by “terrorists” you mean al Qaeda, then I would believe that having US forces increasingly tied down in a war in Iraq.
    How much of their resources have they had to put into the fighting there? Probably not a lot, bin Laden just comes out with a videotape saying that Iraq was now the central war against the US.

  • Oh my gods, I nearly had a fatal laughing fit. I’ll have to be careful, if I see any ReFugs whinging because mean ol’ Hoyer posted their private letter I will keel over.

    The attached map and list of some of the attacks worldwide since 2002 illustrates the global nature of this threat.

    I love the way they have to narrow their focus to “radical islamist” attacks in the past four years, I assume in part because they don’t want to mention the anthrax attacks. But their little cut out from the NYT doesn’t work for a number of reasons:
    1. My average fellow American could give a shit about things that happen over seas. Something blew up in Bali? Yawn.
    2. Limiting the scope of time just allows the Democrats to say “Yeah, and look at all of these other attacks that happened around the world before that. Are you saying Iraq was involved there too? If not, why are we there now?”
    3. Framing it as some sort of global struggle sounds a lot like “We’ll be struggling around the globe until this threat is eradicated.” A country already sick of war doesn’t want to hear that.
    4. Trying to hang the fate of the world on Iraq allows Democrats (and others) to bring up Afghanistan and ObL.

    Really, I knew the Pro-War ReThugs were quite fucked, this memo just tells me that they are at least aware of it.

  • Former Libertarian Presidential candidate and current GOP Congressman of Texas, Ron Paul, in today’s House debate:

    “”The biggest red herring in this debate is the constant innuendo that those who don’t support expanding the war are somehow opposing the troops. It’s nothing more than a canard to claim that those of us who struggled to prevent the bloodshed and now want it stopped are somehow less patriotic and less concerned about the welfare of our military personnel.”

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