FISA ‘compromise’ passes Senate; GOP defeats amendments

There were, regrettably, no surprises on the Senate floor today.

The Senate has approved a bill overhauling the rules on secret government eavesdropping and granting immunity to telecom companies that helped listen in on Americans after Sept. 11.

The Senate passed the bill Wednesday, 69-28. It turned back three amendments that would have watered down, delayed or stripped away the immunity provision demanded by President Bush.

When the president signs the bill, as expected, it will effectively dismiss some 40 lawsuits filed against telecommunications companies for alleged violations of wiretapping and privacy laws.

A handful of Democratic senators, including Sens. Russ Feingold (Wis.), Pat Leahy (Vt.), and Tom Harkin (Iowa), moved to filibuster the bill, but were turned back.

In terms of what this all means, there’s probably no reason to rehash the entire debate. Needless to say, it’s exceedingly disappointing. Andrew Tilghman summarized it this way: “It means that the nation’s largest telecom companies no longer have to worry about a batch of multi-million lawsuits filed by customers angered that the companies turned over their personal information to the government without a warrant. It also means that if you are at home making an overseas phone call to a suspected terrorist, the government can monitor that call without a warrant. And it’s not clear how intel agents define who is a suspected terrorist.”

Earlier today, there were votes on three key amendments. The first, sponsored by Democratic Sens. Chris Dodd (Conn.), Russ Feingold (Wis.), and Pat Leahy (Vt.), would have stripped retroactive telecom immunity from the legislation. It failed on a 32-66 vote (31 Dems — including Obama — and Bernie Sanders).

The second, sponsored by Sen. Arlen Specter (R-Pa.), would have required the courts to consider the legality of Bush’s warrantless-search program before immunity could be granted. It failed on a 37-61 vote (35 Dems — including Obama — and Sanders and Specter).

And third was an amendment from Sen. Jeff Bingaman (D-N.M.) would have put off the immunity question for a year, pending a review of the surveillance program by the Justice Department’s inspector general. This was the closest vote of the three, but it didn’t come close, failing on a 46-52 vote (44 Dems — including Obama — and Sanders and Specter).

John McCain, as per the norm, didn’t show up for work, and didn’t participate in any of the votes.

You can’t expect JSMcC*nt to campaign, work and take his weekends off. That would be too much for a 71 year old man.

Nothing makes JSMcC*nt seem like the third term of BGII like the fact that he’s been taking long weekends off during a General Election campaign.

This is a sad day. I don’t care that much about the Telecoms, but I hate the way this guts our fourth amendment rights.

  • That’s it. I am staying home in November. Best wishes on your presidential try Barack.. It obviously makes no difference who will be in power. They have, somehow, and apparently quickly, gotten to Obama. A very sad day.A very sad day indeed. My worse fears have been realized. We have been sold done the river by the very people we voted in to launch the neocon bastards. They are all in on it. All of them…

  • “Amendment IV

    The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.”

    It’s not possible to reconcile data mining or roving warrantless wiretap surveillance with this language.

  • There really is no silver lining, but I’ll try to come up one: When Obama is President, the Dems will be able to spy on Republicans the same way the Bushies used national security hush-hush” vagaries to spy on REAL Americans, find out all their planned shenanigans without ever needing a warrant, indeed without them ever knowing they’re being spied upon, and there won’t be dick-all they’ll be able to do about it. Because they voted for it. Yup. Obama will be able to call Verizon and tell ’em “Yeah, we think Dick Cheney’s plotting with the terrorists…no we can’t tell you what we know, state secret…no we don’t have a warrant and we don’t need one. Tap him. NOW.”

    Given some time in that sucks-to-be-them hell, I’m willing to bet rule of law will suddenly seem MUCH more important than it has lo these past 8 years.

  • It seems to me that the fact that Obama came out against the War Resolution was meant to show that in DC, he would be able to make the right call when the entire establishment was pressuring you to be wrong.

    Turns out, he just hadn’t felt the pressure yet. That place is like the Borg collective.

  • Too depressed to say anything except that I’m too depressed to say anything.

  • why are you beating up on obama? from what i quickly read above, he voted the right way every time. i’m sorry, it’s not possible for one senator, even one running for president, to control the entire senate.

    less hand-wringing please. the vote sucked, but it wasn’t obama’s fault.

  • 4th Amendment, RIP.

    Maybe they’ll try and reinstate the alien and sedition acts next.

  • Congress’ aproval will be lower than 9% now.Not that Senators or representatives carel. Congress has again proven it does not care about Americans. Pelosi and Hoyer and the Democrats who voted for the demise of the 4th amendment will be damned for listening to lobbyists and not the American people.!!!!

    \When is Bush going to be charged for the folony he committed?? Never as he has it sealed. It is too bad the Republicans run by the NEOcons are in charge and have destroyed America. Voting for Democrats who are just as greedy for $$$$ and power. Americans should rebel and fire the wole damned lot.

    And how come the Republicans can fillibuster and ask for the legislature to be read into the record and Democrats can’t.

  • CB: There were, regrettably, no surprises on the Senate floor today.

    Yep. From the supplied link:

    Presumptive Republican nominee John McCain did not vote.

    Must have been nappy time for McGramps.
    Either that, or he is soft on terrorism.

    Take your pick.

  • How can this Congress be so stupid? How can Democrats be so stupid? Do they not understand what’s at stake?

    Put a fork in the Constitution. It’s done.

    McCain can now say he didn’t vote for the damned thing – and Obama did! Stupid, stupid, stupid.

  • It appears that I was right all along. President Bush has shown he still has enough clout to push through bills, which suggests he is much more popular than his 20-something approval ratings tend to suggest. They should rely less on polling these people, to do more polling of me and my fellow commentators who speak for the little guy.

    If we didn’t represent the true sentiment in the country, Congress would be voting in line with the polls rather than us.

  • Hey, yeah, I agree with #9: Obama voted the right way all three times. Of course, he COULD have moved to shut down the Senate or something, but (nominee or no) he’s NOT the majority leader but a junior Senator. Repeat after me: Obama IS NOT a messiah. He is running for PRESIDENT, not dictator. He is NOT solely responsible for this bill passing and is NOT at ALL responsible for the amendments failing in the Senate.

    Yeah, this sucks. But let’s pit the blame on those who really ARE to blame: the White House that’s striving to legalize their past crimes and the Democratic Congressional leadership that let them do this.

  • obama did not vote the right way every time-he voted yes for cloture which meant eventual defeat. utterly disgusted! ultimate blame should be on the “leadership” that brought this abominable crap to the floor when IT DID NOT HAVE TO!

  • No animal shall wear clothes.

    No animal shall sleep in beds. with sheets.

    No animal shall drink alcohol. to excess.

    No animal shall engage in unwaranted searches and seizures. unless we want to stick our nose in your anus.

    All animals are created equal. but some animals are more equal than others.

  • and another thing…as this election gets closer and the polling gets scarier, I hope that Obama remembers that he stuck a fork into some real die-hard followers for what ever political gain.

    RFK? Hardly. “They” had to shoot him to shut him up. Obama? Not so much. Hopefully someone will dig up the reasons and my guess is that it won’t be pretty. What a traitor to his country for taking a dump on it’s constitution and tangentially, his once strong base…

  • Well, it was either this or impeach Bush, and that would be so…unseemly. Besides it’s off the table remember, how about a slam on Pelosi rather than Barack?

  • why are you beating up on obama? from what i quickly read above, he voted the right way every time. -just bill

    Except on the actual bill itself, which, correct me if I’m wrong, but he said he’d not support if it contained retroactive immunity (despite that only being one part of this horrendous bill).

    The question should be why are you absolving Obama? We’re not Republicans, we shouldn’t demand fealty to our party leaders.

  • Yeah, this sucks. But let’s pit the blame on those who really ARE to blame: the White House that’s striving to legalize their past crimes and the Democratic Congressional leadership that let them do this. -FreeProton

    In case you missed it, the presumptive nominee is part of that leadership now as the defacto leader of the party. There is no way this bill went to the floor without his approval, and no matter how many times you say it, he did not vote the right way every time. Maybe on the amendments, but not on the bill itself.

    Here is the list of the nays on the bill:

    Akaka (D-HI)
    Biden (D-DE)
    Bingaman (D-NM)
    Boxer (D-CA)
    Brown (D-OH)
    Byrd (D-WV)
    Cantwell (D-WA)
    Cardin (D-MD)
    Clinton (D-NY)
    Dodd (D-CT)
    Dorgan (D-ND)
    Durbin (D-IL)
    Feingold (D-WI)
    Harkin (D-IA)
    Kerry (D-MA)
    Klobuchar (D-MN)
    Lautenberg (D-NJ)
    Leahy (D-VT)
    Levin (D-MI)
    Menendez (D-NJ)
    Murray (D-WA)
    Reed (D-RI)
    Reid (D-NV)
    Sanders (I-VT)
    Schumer (D-NY)
    Stabenow (D-MI)
    Tester (D-MT)
    Wyden (D-OR)

    Do you see Obama on that list? No.

  • Be sure to read Greenwald today!

    I got my free Obama for President bumper sticker from Move on today. I put it on my building dumpster and unsubscribed to Move On. I’ll hold my nose and vote for Obama
    (against McCain) but I’m no longer fooled by his spin. Change we can believe in-my ass!

    The San Fransisco Chronicle editorialized today:

    “Warrantless wiretapping of Americans should outrage Congress into banning the practice. But, in a display of political expediency, the Senate is about to bless it, following a similar cave-in by the House last month.

    Making matters worse, both likely presidential candidates — Sens. Barack Obama and John McCain – plan to reverse their opposition and vote for the White House-backed rewrite of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. The bigger of the two reversals is Obama, who earlier this year had promised a filibuster to defeat the bill.”

  • susan g said:

    obama did not vote the right way every time-he voted yes for cloture which meant eventual defeat. utterly disgusted! ultimate blame should be on the “leadership” that brought this abominable crap to the floor when IT DID NOT HAVE TO!
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Exactly right. First off, as the leader of the party (and controller of a lot of $$$), he could have stood up against this and influenced many more people to do so. Secondly, he voted for the final bill, including immunity and all the other crap in it.

    Will it be okay for you or me to go out and commit crimes and then expect retroactive immunity? Hell no. The transition to a Corporatist government is now complete.

    My only hope (and someone here please tell me if this is possible) is that this entire law can be challenged in court.

  • Stevio and other.
    Grow up!!!!! I am not at all crazy about the FISA vote but you know what elect Obama so that the law can be reformed. You don’t stay home and say game over because you hit ONE setback. You find another way to do it. Now I see why the left loses. It is all about purity and little or no stategic thinking.

  • A couple of thoughts on this.
    -Yes, this is a sad day when Congress votes to gut the 4th amendment.

    -I’m more mad at the House leadership caving, then I am Obama.

    -The flip side to this vote is that if it didn’t pass, and another terrorist attack happens, the Democrats could kiss any majority in both houses good-bye…or at least that’s the perception.

    -The in-coming President doesn’t have to use these increased surveillance tactics. I trust a President Obama to stop these practices. I don’t trust a President McCain to stop these practices. I’ll still donate to Obama and vote in November.

    -I think we need to work as hard as possible to get Obama elected, and with him in office and Democratic majorities in both offices, work to get this law changed.

    – I wonder why Obama didn’t choose to skip the vote like McCain. Then their couldn’t be any finger-pointing

  • Micheline,

    You know what – it’s not about purity. He can compromise on something less important than the heart of the f#king constitution.

  • Wonderful. Now, between our Independence day and Bastile Day, we can celebrate “Whittle Away the Constitution Day” on July 9th every year. We needed another July celebration anyway.

    Ugh.

  • I cannot vote for Obama now–this is so depressing. What is happening here?!?

  • susan_g has it right, several commenters above have it wrong: by voting for cloture last week, Obama essentially voted for the bill while appearing to have voted against it today.

    The USA is well on its way now to becoming an elective dictatorship, since the principle has been established that, when the President, or designated official, asks a citizen or corporation to do something, that something is legal, and, if the executive is disobeyed, the result will be the weight of the federal government landing on the one who disobeyed (see Qwest.)

    sic transit gloria mundi, limited, constitutional government.

    Of course, we can always hope that the Republicans, when faced with getting involuntary colonoscopies by a Democratically-controlled federal bureaucracy, will come to their senses, but, given the intellectual level of the Republicans in the Senate (Cronyn, Inhofe, Brownback, for example) — that’s extremely unlikely. Far more likely that they’ll want to keep it in place for when their turn comes around.

    Meanwhile, rule of law and personal freedom get reamed, thanks to
    the fear of terrorism. And terrorism wins the “war on terror.”

  • Except on the actual bill itself, which, correct me if I’m wrong, but he said he’d not support if it contained retroactive immunity (despite that only being one part of this horrendous bill).

    No, he didn’t say that. He said he’d vote for it but would “work” to get retroactive immunity out of it. In other words, he told us upfront that he would fuck us, so he gets some kind of bizarre points for that.

  • I trust a President Obama to stop these practices. -JT

    Be careful. I trusted him to stand up for the constitution, and he didn’t.

    I think instead of trusting the president, I’ll rely on checks and balances.

    Even this SCOTUS may find this bill unconstitutional since it’s purpose is to limit the power of the court. Too bad the RATS block is our last hope for defense of the fourth amendment. I doubt they’re willing to relinquish power to the executive.

  • Hedge-betting and Kow Towing to fear- because warrantless wiretapping has gotten us SO much closer to nabbing OBL….

    but wait…didn’t the Saudis bankroll the Mujahadeen in the 80’s…and who are we friendly with?
    America since Reagan/Bush has been begging, borrowing and stealing from Terrorists from day one. I say we tap the WH phones right away.

    Iran/contra? Stinger missiles? Noriega? Ortega? Hussein?

    It’s a merry go round puppet theater. Time to close the ride.
    The Axis of evil spins around Washington. Just ask Charlie Black and John McCain- scum loyal to none but the greenback, “my friends”.

    Don’t blame one Senator…sometimes you have to fake a pass to win a game.

  • No, he didn’t say that. -Maria

    I meant way back before, not his recent statement. Didn’t he at one point say he wouldn’t support a bill that included retroactive immunity and that he would filibuster it?

    I really think he did. I knew he was hedging in his recent statement, but I think he was most absolute months ago.

  • I have a question for opponents of this bill. Why were there no holds placed on this bill? Are holds reserved for the GOP?

    It’s amazing that congress couldn’t pass this bill under Frist and Hastert. Bush had to wait for Pelosi, Hoyer and Reid’s brand of leadership, not to mention the dem nominee for president. Liberty weeps.

  • I don’t know WHY Obama would do this, and vote for this ruin of a bill – just boggles the mind. I think Dems could have dealt with the bad players but when Obama was one of them too.

    And this over on Kos:

    Obama Voted No On Immunity & Got Fisa Right
    by HatchInBrooklyn

    All these idiots that mindless follow Obama don’t even have enough sense to shut-up for a second. Very depressing.

  • why are you beating up on obama? from what i quickly read above, he voted the right way every time. i’m sorry, it’s not possible for one senator, even one running for president, to control the entire senate.

    Um, no. Read more closely. Obama voted the right way on all three of the amendments to be sure. He then turned around and voted FOR cloture on the bill, and then voted FOR the bill.

    He also came out the other week in favor of the bill, putting his stamp of approval on it. He could have just as easily come out against the bill – he could have used his influence as the defacto leader of the party to shut it down, or at least generate some movement against it. He did neither – by coming out in favor of it he used his influence to get it passed instead.

    less hand-wringing please. the vote sucked, but it wasn’t obama’s fault.

    The vote may not be Obama’s fault but his actions are. He voted for the bill, and by coming out in favor of it the other week pretty much guaranteed its passage. He obviously wanted this bill passed and was, to be charitable, lying a few months back when he said he was against it. (And yes, calling it lying is being charitable about this particular little back-stabbing maneuver).

    Does this mean I won’t vote for him come November? Of course not. That’s a juvenile attitude to take. What I am a bit upset about are that his supporters aren’t waking up and realizing that he needs to be watched like a hawk and held accountable like any other politician does. The question should be “what can we do to hold these guys accountable”, not throwing up our hands and declaring that we aren’t going to vote (or worse, vote for McCain). I wish I knew the answer – so far the only good ones I’ve heard are Greenwald’s which basically amounts to “target the Blue Dogs that allowed this to happen and get them replaced with people who will repeal this idiocy.” That’s something worth getting behind.

  • Maria, others,

    It was Bill Burton, Obama’s spokesperson, way back in October, 2007:

    To be clear: Barack will support a filibuster of any bill that includes retroactive immunity for telecommunications companies.

    Maybe by support he meant he’d send cupcakes.

  • just bill said:
    why are you beating up on obama? from what i quickly read above, he voted the right way every time. i’m sorry, it’s not possible for one senator, even one running for president, to control the entire senate.

    Obama should have lead the filibuster fight instead of voting to shut it down. He could have promised every Democratic Senator up for re-election that he would come to their state and fill whatever size stadium they wanted, and then allowed them to give their campaign speech to the crowd. He could have offered to request a $5 donation to the Senator’s campaign at the door of the event, which would more than offset the bribes contributions the Senator accepted from the telecomm corporations.

    And Obama should have voted against gutting the Fourth Amendment.

    He’ll get my vote because I’m not stupid enough to vote for McCain. But he won’t get my time or money.

  • I have a question for opponents of this bill. Why were there no holds placed on this bill? Are holds reserved for the GOP? -Johnny Clamboat

    Dodd did on the old FISA bill in 2007. Reid ignored it.

    If Reid will ignore Dodd’s hold without the blessing of the presumptive nominee, what’s to stop him with Obama behind him? Obama is really the only one who could’ve put a hold on this.

  • Matt in Eugene,

    We admire Lincoln and FDR even though they themselves shredded portions of the constitution, in particular the fourth amendment.

    All I am saying is that the fight must go on but done in a strategic fashion. One is to get Obama elected. Another is to inform the American public about the effects of this law and why it should be reformed or abolished. If progressives did the latter from the get go may be Congress would not have voted the way it did. All this screaming about Obama is not going to lead to anything.

  • I can’t help but notice that Clinton voted against the bill, while Obama voted for it.

    Yes, I ended up supporting Clinton in the primaries and yes, I will vote for Obama over McCain in November (multiple times if it was legal), but I never bought into the Obama=Messiah/Clinton=antiChrist crap that has been all over the progressive blogosphere for months. The Repubilicans have to be kicked out if the US is to have any hope. What has always worried me about the Obama worship is that when his starry-eyed supporters finally saw him behaving acting like a politician, and no one who runs for President is not a politician, they would go into this “Oh my! He is like all the rest. I am staying home in November!” funk.

    Let the flaming begin.

  • FreeProton said:
    Yeah, this sucks. But let’s pit the blame on those who really ARE to blame: the White House that’s striving to legalize their past crimes and the Democratic Congressional leadership that let them do this.

    Since Obama isn’t getting any money from me, that leaves more that I can donate to Cindy Sheehan’s independent campaign for Nancy Pelosi’s House seat.
    http://www.cindyforcongress.org/

    Everyone here who is spitting mad that this bill passed should send a donation to Sheehan’s campaign and then call Speaker Pelosi’s office and let them know what you did and why.

    (For the record, I have no affiliation with the Sheehan campaign and live on the opposite side of the country.)

  • many here owe the Clintons and her supporters an apology – when the US Constitution was on the line, obama sided with the bush administration and corporate interests. Hillary voted NO!

    Obama is not a progressive, liberal, and most certainly not a “constitutional scholar” – he has given bush what nixon was impeached over. The power to declare all law breaking as legal!

    Many here should have listened to mary, mark and the others instead of baiting, flaming, and banning them. Want to see what Chicago residents think of obama?

    Obama’s Shameful Housing Record

    Must-see video for those that think obama is anything other than a corporate shill.

    Dr. King, who was mercilessly hounded and spied on by the federal government must be rolling in his grave.

    The first African American presidential nominee agrees with richard nixon, “if the president says it’s legal, then it is legal.”

    Shameful – when it comes to action, obama stands for nothing.

  • Obama should have lead the filibuster fight instead of voting to shut it down. -SteveT

    You mean the filibuster he vowed to support in October, 2007? Why on earth would you expect him to uphold something he said eight months ago?

    Oh, and Obama is not a flip flopper. No siree. Never.

    I’m fully with the people voting ‘not McCain’ now.

    All these idiots that mindless follow Obama don’t even have enough sense to shut-up for a second. Very depressing. -Me_again

    Mindless chattle, justifying the destruction of our constitution. Had Obama been on the side of good, these same people would be outraged at the Republicans and the blue dogs, but instead we get listen to the tinkling sound of their cognitive dissonance shattering and falling down around them as the desperately try to pick up the pieces and rationalize the destruction of the rule of law, the right to privacy, and their hopes and dreams.

    But don’t worry, they assure us. Obama won’t abuse the power.

  • MW – if we are going to let the constitution be dismembered, why have a faux “democrat” that proclaims himself a “constitutional scholar” in the white house?

    Let the history books show that the republicans sided with corporate interests and sold us out. I will never support a democrat for the white house that lies to win the nominee (promises not telecom immunity) actually votes to eliminate the 4th ammendment.

    This is just the beginning of a long list of lies from the latest media “darling” – if you think obama stands for meaningful change, you are listening to the crap he spews and are not paying any attention to how he gives it to you in the read-end.

  • Dodd did on the old FISA bill in 2007. Reid ignored it.

    If Reid will ignore Dodd’s hold without the blessing of the presumptive nominee, what’s to stop him with Obama behind him? Obama is really the only one who could’ve put a hold on this. – doubtful

    Ahh yes, I forgot about Dodd’s hold the first time around. A senator with a spine should have tried it again to put Harry Reid on the spot.

  • …many here owe the Clintons and her supporters an apology… -johnny

    Don’t get ahead of yourself. She may have been right on this, but she’s certainly been wrong before (AUMF, Kyl-Lieberman, etc.). I applaud her vote on this, though, as I do all of the Democrats and Independent who voted with us and the constitution.

    Oh, and you just brought up Larry Sinclair. All reasonable discourse with you is now moot. Thanks for playing.

  • MW – if we are going to let the constitution be dismembered, why have a faux “democrat” that proclaims himself a “constitutional scholar” in the white house?

    Because the only game in town is now McCain or Obama. Staying home in November is equivalent to voting for McCain. Just remember how well it worked in 2000 when people voted for Ralph Nader because “there is no difference between Bush and Gore”. I am not defending Obama’s vote today — I think it was indefensible. The last eight years have been catastrophic for the US and the world. Voting for McCain, or staying home and not voting for Obama because he is a politician, is the equivalent of voting for another four years like the last eight.

  • Staying home in November is equivalent to voting for McCain – MW

    I beg to differ. If dems are going to kowtow to lobbyists or the GOP then they don’t deserve my vote. Blame Nader for Gore’s loss all you want; Gore couldn’t make the sale.

  • Main Entry: fas·cism
    Pronunciation: \ˈfa-ˌshi-zəm also ˈfa-ˌsi-\
    Function: noun
    Etymology: Italian fascismo, from fascio bundle, fasces, group, from Latin fascis bundle & fasces fasces
    Date: 1921
    1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

  • With this new direction of Obama in voting for FISA is not only disappointing but a serious derogation to the electorates Constitutional rights. Obama said it’s not the best compromise but will do. This may obviously show that Obama does not know how to compromise.

    So, now Americans know how the pages of history will be turned. Or, yes we can, give away the house, our liberties, and civil rights plus kneel and be expected to bow to the best and further Judgement of Barack Obama, which appears to be in favor of Bush and Company. Further proof when those Republican supporters, the Obamacans whispered “Hey Barrack I am a Republican but will vote for you”. Barrack whispered back “Hang in there for I will stay the course”. Sure is.

    The Obamush and Company is created

  • Oh, by the way… how did Hillary vote? She voted no! Just like she said she would during the primary. Let’s see, Obama said he would do what? Oh yes, filibuster. Wow, I bet his change of heart is change we all can believe in. NOT!

  • It’s ironic that the Republicans will now be calling Obama a "flip-flopper" – if they truly believed in their own ideals, like immunity for telecom companies, they would welcome Obama’s recent shifts. But Obama’s vote is more interesting for what it tells us about him – the depth of his ideals, how he will stand up (or not) to the Republicans, during and after the campaign, and whether he is a true change candidate.
    Can the kids believe in Obama?

  • Ask for your donations to the Obama primary campaign to be returned to you so you can send them to those who voted against FISA. They all have campaign funds if not debts.

  • The vote has happened our freedoms have been diminished Obama will most likely become the next Emperor, sad, but not hopeless. I have been following and contributing to progressive candidates, this is where the next battle is. The Emperor can only rule if everyone lets him, a progressive Congress can still win back our freedoms lost.

  • Okay M-Liberal,

    I read it, and here’s a few gems:

    I learned long ago, when working as an organizer on the South Side of Chicago, that when citizens join their voices together, they can hold their leaders accountable.

    Sounds like some of us actually want to hold our leader accountable.

    The ability to monitor and track individuals who want to attack the United States is a vital counter-terrorism tool, and I’m persuaded that it is necessary to keep the American people safe — particularly since certain electronic surveillance orders will begin to expire later this summer.

    Wasn’t the the debunked excuse we didn’t accept from President Bush?

    That’s why I support striking Title II from the bill, and will work with Chris Dodd, Jeff Bingaman and others in an effort to remove this provision in the Senate.

    Lie. He did not support their effort in any meaningful way.

    It grants retroactive immunity to telecommunications companies that may have violated the law by cooperating with the Bush Administration’s program of warrantless wiretapping. This potentially weakens the deterrent effect of the law and removes an important tool for the American people to demand accountability for past abuses.

    That sounds unacceptable. Why vote for it?

    What Obama doesn’t tell you is how it consolidates spy power in the executive and virtually removes the judicial check. What Obama doesn’t tell you is that it waters down the official definition of WMD so that even a grenade would qualify. Now Bush can say Iran has WMD. He can say legitimately that Iraq had WMD. Hell, who doesn’t have WMD now?

    Sorry, I don’t understand his statement of support. I don’t care if he respects the ‘activism and passion’ of those organizing against him on this issue. It’s irrelevant to his evisceration of our constitution.

  • Yes, you’re right, doubtful; I thought you were talking about his statements two weeks ago.

  • The vote has happened our freedoms have been diminished Obama will most likely become the next Emperor, sad, but not hopeless

    No, Obama will handle the laws just responsibly to legitimize them in the eyes of the public, but not enough to prevent the Press from having a hissy-fit over some abuse-of-power scandal, so that it will be too entrenched in our laws to remove them when Republicans return to finish the transition to monarchy and permanent Republican majority.

    The Press won’t report it to make up for the Scandal-mongering of the Obama years, and besides, everyone does it, which makes you a bunch of hypocrites for complaining when you whined about as framing Obama over nothing. Not to mention, the Press is now under State control.

  • And here I thought Democrats who cared about the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were in control of the House and Senate and able to stifle this kind of obnoxiousness. Wrong again.

  • This so conveniently took place after the last primary – so Democrats had no opportunity to punish the scoundrels with a primary challenge.

    If nothing else, we can make their lives miserable in ’10. I certainly plan to support any Democratic challenge to everyone who voted in favor of executive and coorporate criminality.

  • To those of you who said Obama would have voted for the Iraq invasion if he had been in the Senate – it unfortunately looks like you were right. Words are so very cheap. When push comes to shove, he votes with the herd.

  • We need a lobbying firm for the people. I’m sorry to say it has come to that.

    As for this issue, I’ll be sending my next installment meant for the Obama campaign to the ACLU. We all need to get behind the ACLU. They are our only line of defense now.

  • 23 percent approval rating. plus-80 percent disapproval rating. chronic liar, war criminal, thief, draft-dodger, anti-intellectual, juvenile, drunk, punk and fool on one side.

    agents of change, party-in-majority, party with the funds, with the moral high ground and with public opinion widely behind them on the other.

    and they can’t screw up enough courage to do the right thing, when it’s black and white as … well .. black and white.

    you people are doomed.

    continur your simpering and whining until you disappear into oblivion; which is clearly on the near-horizon. you cannot be helped. good luck with the collapse of your civilization —- no other civilization so clearly had it coming, and so clearly deserved it and brought it on by over-medication, malaise, triviality and spinelessness. you people are absolutely pathetic.

  • Why does the statement always say …”…who spied on Americans after 9/11″ when they were spying way before then in Feb and long before that.

    There was no downside to Obama opposing this bill whether it passed or not. His explanations are non-sensical and borrowed from Pelosi..refuted point by point by Glenn Greenwald at salon.com.

    There were no citizen groups calling for more spying power and the polls showed the majority of Americans opposed the bill. Obama would have been doing not only what was right but also what was politically correct and popular. It would do more to get him elected by opposing it than by supporting it. Now the right are playing the “if he came around to our way of thinking on FISA and national security (do what the government says or be killed by terrorists) then he will also come around to our way of thinking on Iraq etc.”…which is exactly what the McCain campaign has begun doing.

    Whatever the real reason…and we have yet to learn it…it did more harm to Obama than opposing it ever could dream of doing.

    This is a black day for America, the rule of law and our democracy. Stupid dems don’t even care that they will be the 1st victims of the new spying power…just as they were when it was illegal for Bush to do it. If this is representative of “change we can believe in” I’ve lost my faith and my enthusiasm. I reject it whether it comes from McCain or Obama and especially our dem leaders.
    I would just as soon have a republican I hate as a dem who embarrasses me and makes me ashamed to call myself a dem as far as congress is concerned. The dem leaders in congress have done the same job as if they were in the minority.

    Senator McCaskill D-MO (Obama supporter) votes the same as Kit Bond R-MO but claims to be a progressive standing for change in Washington and the way they do business.

    Only an idiot would claim “It’s not worth Obama losing the election over” when opposing this FISA capitulation would have done just the opposite but now questions his character.

  • Someone asked: Why are you beating up on Obama for this vote?

    The answer has to do with expectations unmet & unrealized; with HOPE dashed and splintered on the floor. It is an emotional response.

  • Are we still supposed to believe that Obama would not have voted for the AUMF? I guess this is some sort of Sister Souljah moment of FU to the constitution. He’s going to have to revise his lesson plans for Constitution 101 to a Living Document D.O.A.

  • A benevolent dictator is still a dictator. Trusting Obama not to use power he shouldn’t have in the first place is a ridiculous position for a free nation to find itself in.

    Trust is earned. You trusted Obama’s word and look what happened. Why does he deserve any more trust?

    Hillary showed Obama what a Democrat looks like, what a patriotic American looks like (one who believes that supporting the constitution protects our freedom better than spying), what a person with guts looks like. I am proud to have voted for her. Don’t you wish you could say the same thing about your candidate?

  • Folks,

    If you continue to give your votes to those who trash our Constitution while being righteously outraged because of those who voted for the FISA bill, do you REALLY think it will be a check on their further trashing of the Constitution?

    We are all between a rock and a hard place, and I know we’ll be asking ourselves what’s the best thing to do now.

    I feel as though Obama has pulled the rug right out from under me, and I know millions more feel the same way. He’s made a cluster of statements recently, in addition to his vote on FISA, like his comment about the Supreme Court decision on abortion, and how he’d withdraw the troops from Iraq now. Those who believe that he must be elected so the Supreme Court can become more centrist need to take a good look at Obama’s recent switches and more to come, and consider that he’s apparently comfortable with a great many rightwing positions of the Bush administration.

    What will we do if it becomes obvious he won’t recommend Justices who are centrist or left of center because of his own political sympathies?

    What’s left to do? Riot on the streets?

  • In the midst of the bad news, a shout out to Amy Klobuchar, who had voted Blue Dog way to many times given she’s from Minnesota, but who got it right today. Also a shout to another midwesterner, Tom Harkin, who muffed a few votes immediately after 9/11, but has been solid as a rock on the FISA bill. And of course to she for whom I voted in the primaries, Hillary Clinton, and Chris Dodd, who I would have voted for had it not been a lost cause by then. And to Maria Cantwell, who has been moving up and up my “dark horse for VP” list.

    On the other hand, lets hope this ends any talk of a VP nod for McCaskill, who has voted wrong nearly every time it counted, and ends the Webb-mania among progressives who should know better – Webb is useful on Iraq, but he is a single-issue progressive.

    Obama’s performance was shameful, but he is the nominee and the only viable option is McCain, who was not only wrong on the bill but was too f*cking cowardly to show up and be counted. And a President McCain would ensure that the Biden’s, Dodd’s, Harkin’s, Feingold’s and yes Clinton’s have no ability to get anything done, even if Reid is deposed. A President Obama at least provides opportunities for a strong Democratic Congress to use its powers for good.

  • And to Maria Cantwell, who has been moving up and up my “dark horse for VP” list.

    She’s on mine also. I think it’s unlikely but a possibility.

    Patty Murray also voted against this, so we’re 2 for 2 in Washington.

    McCaskill was always a crazy idea. There has never been any there there.

  • Augh, what came into my head!

    McCain now has a better record this year for rights than Obama.

    Of course, Clinton actually voted against this one, rather than just not voting, so hey.

    Like I said before. You guys chose Obama. You’d better be there to put him in the Oval Office come November.

  • Like I said before [yes, she certainly did–ad nauseam. -Ed.]. You guys chose Obama. You’d better be there to put him in the Oval Office come November.

    Or she’ll sic her iguana on you. Please, guys, promise you’ll vote for Obama in November so we don’t have to listen to her run through her painfully limited repertoire for four more months.

    I am proud to have voted for her.

    You forgot all that other stuff she did that pissed you off, all the stuff you got tangibly uncomfortable about when we brought it all up? All those times you abruptly changed the subject, red-faced–you forgot them just like that? Damn, you are a cheap lay.

  • The ACLU is taking donations and is planning to file suit the day King George III signs this travesty. I was going to donate to the Obama campaign, but I’ll give the money to the ACLU instead and double the amount.

    …didn’t we fight a war for independence over this a few years back, or something?…unreasonable search and seizure…quartering troops in homes…the rights of the accused to hear the evidence against them…did I imagine it all?

  • O please please vote McCain. Please do!

    And then may you all get precisely what you wanted: 8 years worth, down your throats. I will watch with pure bliss all the bitching and bemoaning as you come to realize what blithering idiots you’ve been.

    Hurrah for the Grand Old Party! They could offer roadkill as a candidate and still win.

  • And doubtful, you’ve finally shown your true colors. Now just smack that merry McCain bumper sticker on your ass, and staple a flag pin to your forehead and you can come out of the closet entirely.

  • Today the majority of our elected officals [Senators] sent two messages out,loud and clear,to not only to the terrorist but to the world that “they” believe that we as a nation are too weak to fight them unless we change our Constitution in order to do it. They also told the terrorist and the world that the majority of our elected officals believe that there are some in our Gov.t who are above the laws of this land. Adding those two facts to the obvious collapsing of our economy and there can be no doubt that they,the majority of our elected officals, believe that the terrorist are winning..which they confirmed to be the case by their passing of the FISA bill. Many of us were surprised that they didn’t send Bin Lauden an apology while they were at it.

    A happy day in the White house and at the telecom offices no doubt, but a day of mourning by the American peope. It was for many of us a day of shame and disgrace, for this once great nation. Today we learn that the majority of our Senators believe that in order to fight the terrorist we must become just like them.

    The only good that came out of the passing of this bill is that we,the people, can see who voted NO on this bill. In doing so we now know which of them aren’t so afraid of the terrorist that they took a stand for preserving our Constitution as well as our Judicial system. They said NO to terrorist as well as NO to letting some in our Gov.t be above the laws of our land…regardless of who those crimals might be. Which will all be…very useful info to have… come next election day.

    Jae

  • Please ladies Maria and Daze, not Maria Cantwell! This Seattleite has voted for her twice– although I was holding my nose in 2006. Call her office on any issue and you will never get an answer as to where she stands. Cantwell is no leader she is a follower. I am a big admirer of Murray “the Mom in tennis shoes” though-most of the time anyway.

    If Obama wins the Presidency,I don’t expect much from him. It will be mainly a reprise of Clinton era triangulation politics.

  • Hillary Clinton’s statement concerning her rejection of FISA:

    “One of the great challenges before us as a nation is remaining steadfast in our fight against terrorism while preserving our commitment to the rule of law and individual liberty. As a senator from New York on September 11, I understand the importance of taking any and all necessary steps to protect our nation from those who would do us harm. I believe strongly that we must modernize our surveillance laws in order to provide intelligence professionals the tools needed to fight terrorism and make our country more secure. However, any surveillance program must contain safeguards to protect the rights of Americans against abuse, and to preserve clear lines of oversight and accountability over this administration. I applaud the efforts of my colleagues who negotiated this legislation, and I respect my colleagues who reached a different conclusion on today’s vote. I do so because this is a difficult issue. Nonetheless, I could not vote for the legislation in its current form.

    More…

    The legislation would overhaul the law that governs the administration’s surveillance activities. Some of the legislation’s provisions place guidelines and restrictions on the operational details of the surveillance activities, others increase judicial and legislative oversight of those activities, and still others relate to immunity for telecommunications companies that participated in the administration’s surveillance activities.
    While this legislation does strengthen oversight of the administration’s surveillance activities over previous drafts, in many respects, the oversight in the bill continues to come up short. For instance, while the bill nominally calls for increased oversight by the FISA Court, its ability to serve as a meaningful check on the President’s power is debatable. The clearest example of this is the limited power given to the FISA Court to review the government’s targeting and minimization procedures.

    But the legislation has other significant shortcomings. The legislation also makes no meaningful change to the immunity provisions. There is little disagreement that the legislation effectively grants retroactive immunity to the telecommunications companies. In my judgment, immunity under these circumstances has the practical effect of shutting down a critical avenue for holding the administration accountable for its conduct. It is precisely why I have supported efforts in the Senate to strip the bill of these provisions, both today and during previous debates on this subject. Unfortunately, these efforts have been unsuccessful.

    What is more, even as we considered this legislation, the administration refused to allow the overwhelming majority of Senators to examine the warrantless wiretapping program. This made it exceedingly difficult for those Senators who are not on the Intelligence and Judiciary Committees to assess the need for the operational details of the legislation, and whether greater protections are necessary. The same can be said for an assessment of the telecom immunity provisions. On an issue of such tremendous importance to our citizens – and in particular to New Yorkers – all Senators should have been entitled to receive briefings that would have enabled them to make an informed decision about the merits of this legislation. I cannot support this legislation when we know neither the nature of the surveillance activities authorized nor the role played by telecommunications companies granted immunity.

    Congress must vigorously check and balance the president even in the face of dangerous enemies and at a time of war. That is what sets us apart. And that is what is vital to ensuring that any tool designed to protect us is used – and used within the law – for that purpose and that purpose alone. I believe my responsibility requires that I vote against this compromise, and I will continue to pursue reforms that will improve our ability to collect intelligence in our efforts to combat terror and to oversee that authority in Congress.”

    http://www.talkleft.com/story/2008/7/9/17456/93329

    See guys, you CAN stand on principle and not pander when you’ve got a substantive record unlike Obama.

  • I don’t think daze is a woman, Geeeez, but I take your point. I’m not sure Cantwell would make a good VP; I just think she might be on the list. Nowhere near the top, though.

    Catherine, we would have been with you in your praise of Clinton for voting against FISA, but then you had to go and render yourself ludicrous with: “See guys, you CAN stand on principle and not pander when you’ve got a substantive record unlike Obama.” The ability of Clinton people to cover their eyes and pretend her AUMF, Kyl-Lieberman, flag-burning, etc., etc., etc., votes weren’t pandering is always freshly hilarious. What in the world in her “substantive record” would lead you to believe she’s suddenly seen the light and stopped her near-constant pandering now? It was only weeks ago she was McCain-endorsing, gas-tax-holidaying and hardworking-white-folksing her little heart out.

    I’m fairly certain Clinton would have voted yea yesterday had she been the nominee, but she’s not and never was going to be. So I don’t see the point in that kind of speculation, except in the possibility that, with Clinton not running for president for the first time in eight years, the people of New York might finally get a more progressive junior senator. (In the interest of fairness, I’ll also note that the people of Illinois could also use a JS further to the left, and that Obama, like Clinton, has been running for prez since the day he hit the Senate.) The issue now is that Obama fucked up royally and what happens next. Trying to reanimate the corpse of Clinton nomination hope is just sad at this point. Ain’t gonna happen. Move on.

  • -daze,

    You really should try to work on your credulity index. Amy Klobuchar voted against the bill, yes, but she voted for cloture, so the votes against were just theater for the sake of idiots.

    I am now pledged to support a primary campaign against her and I will vote for whoever opposes her in 2010.

    To all those who deride me voting for a non-Democrat, well, sorry, but remember, I’m a single-issue voter. If a candidate isn’t for the rule of law, I cannot vote for them.

  • And doubtful, you’ve finally shown your true colors. Now just smack that merry McCain bumper sticker on your ass, and staple a flag pin to your forehead and you can come out of the closet entirely. -MsMuddled

    Huh? I’m to left (since supporting the constitution is now a lefty thing) of Obama on this issue so logic dictates I’m a McCain supporter? It seems you do not understand the capacity to disagree with a politician on one or even many issues but still support them over another, even less agreeable choice.

    I have been a vociferous Obama supporter for many months, years if you count my support for his Senate campaign and I have disagreed with him on several issues along the way. This happens to be an issues I disagree with him vehemently on, but if you check back an article, you’ll see me defending of his call for bilingual literacy.

    I’m passionate and consistent in my viewpoints and will call out anyone, Democrat or Republican, for failing to side with the constitution and the citizens of this great country.

    So frankly, you can blow it out your undemocratic ass.

  • I completely understand why Obama voted the way he did — for years the GOP has lobbed the “WEAK ON SECURITY!!” grenade at Dems, and the media has been willing to pull the pin. So by voting for the immunity-stripping amendments, he showed his displeasure with that aspect, and by voting for the bill he snuffs out one of the GOP’s traditional lines of attack.

    Also, most Americans have no clue what this bill does, and it seems as though most don’t care. Hell, most Americans can’t even name the three branches of government, so expecting them to know anything about this bill but what the media has fed them is probably too much to expect.

    So I get the political reality.

    HOWEVER …

    This was the time to stand up for the document upon which our nation was founded and restore it to it’s place as the pinnacle of how we act as a nation.

    This was the time to stand up for the rule of law, reaffirming our Founder’s belief that no one—not a person, not a President, and not a company—is above the law.

    This was the time to show true leadership on an issue that will shape how future generations view the separation of powers and the theory of checks and balances.

    This was the time to show we are better than China, or Saudi Arabia, or old-school Russia, unwilling to sacrifice the freedoms central to our democracy just for some false notion of security.

    This was the time for Obama to pass the leadership test and show he truly is a different kind of politician, ready to stand up and rebuild all that Bush has destroyed these past seven and a half years.

    He failed.

    So once again, I find myself forced to vote against someone (McCain), rather than for someone.

    I really, really thought it’d be different this time … I guess that’s what I get for getting my hopes up.

  • Truly, one of the lower moments in our republic.

    I’m deeply disappointed in Obama. Perhaps he could not have won this on his own, but his support would have made a huge difference, and he has shown where principles fall before pragmatism. Ultimately, he shares this blame with other Dems.

    Even Chris Dodd’s leadership this time around was weaker, it seemed like he was only willing to resume banging this drum when it was obvious that it was a lost cause.

    This won’t keep me from voting for Obama (though it does dampen my enthusiasm a lot), but it does mean that I would not support the DSCC, ever ever ever. Give me Russ Feingold and his progressive patriots (and the ACLU) any day.

  • Comments are closed.