Goldberg, Gonzales, and ‘the will of the uninformed’

Jonah Goldberg devotes his LA Times column today to a subject near and dear to my heart: the uninformed electorate. In this case, Goldberg acknowledges that most Americans express concern about the prosecutor purge scandal, but he makes an intellectually consistent case — public opinion doesn’t matter because people don’t know what they’re talking about.

Huge numbers of Americans don’t know jack about their government or politics. According to a Pew Research Center survey released last week, 31% of Americans don’t know who the vice president is, fewer than half are aware that Nancy Pelosi is the speaker of the House, a mere 29% can identify “Scooter” Libby as the convicted former chief of staff of the vice president, and only 15% can name Harry Reid when asked who is the Senate majority leader.

Also last week, a Washington Post-ABC News poll found that two-thirds of Americans believe that Atty. Gen. Alberto R. Gonzales’ firing of eight U.S. attorneys was “politically motivated.”

So, we are supposed to believe that two-thirds of Americans have studied the details of the U.S. attorney firings and come to an informed conclusion that they were politically motivated — even when Senate Democrats agree that there is no actual evidence that Gonzales did anything improper. Are these the same people who couldn’t pick Pelosi out of a lineup? Or the 85% who couldn’t name the Senate majority leader? Are we to imagine that the 31% of the electorate who still — after seven years of headlines and demonization — can’t identify the vice president of the United States nonetheless have a studied opinion on the firing of New Mexico U.S. Atty. David Iglesias?

This may be shamelessly elitist, but it’s not necessarily unreasonable. Too often, conservatives will manipulate polls until they say what the right wants to hear. Goldberg is taking the opposite approach — yes the polls are against me, but it doesn’t matter because people don’t know what they’re talking about and I do. There’s a certain intellectual consistency to the position.

But I think Goldberg may be missing the implications of public opinion here.

The political world is almost constantly looking for clues about whether a story (or a controversy or a meme) is catching on outside the beltway and having a discernable impact on the typical American. Polls offer the most quantitative results, so they inevitably draw intense scrutiny. And right now, the polls show the public on the critics’ side when it comes to the White House purge scandal.

Is the electorate always right? Of course not. Do Americans always know all the details? Definitely not. Do they sometimes have opinions on issues on which they’re largely uninformed? Sure.

But even if Americans don’t know who Carol Lam or Monica Goodling are, they nevertheless suspect something’s fishy about the purge. The public has probably heard at least something about this controversy over the last couple of months, and they’re not impressed with the Bush gang’s defense. The White House and Gonzales have waged a fairly aggressive public relations campaign and the public just isn’t buying it. Whether voters can name the Vice President is beside the point — the political establishment wants to know who’s winning the fight, and when two-thirds of Americans believe there was something fishy with the firing of eight U.S. attorneys, it offers politicians cover to continue pursuing the matter. If the poll results were reversed, you better believe Republicans would be emphasizing that fact.

In a situation like this one, voters don’t necessarily have to know all the details. They’ve gotten to know the White House, they’ve heard a bit about the controversy, and they have a pretty good sense of right and wrong. From what they’ve heard, this purge falls into the “wrong” category. Goldberg seems to believe this conclusion is meaningless because the masses are dolts; would he say the same thing if polls showed Americans approving of the war and disapproving of the Democrats’ policy agenda?

I should add that the rest of Goldberg’s column goes into detail lamenting the widespread ignorance of the American public, beyond just the one scandal. “Americans — God bless ’em — are often quite ignorant about the stuff politicians and pundits think matters most,” he said. “They may know piles about their own professions, hobbies and personal interests, but when it comes to basic civics, they just get their clocks cleaned on Fox’s ‘Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader?'”

And while there’s certainly some truth in that, Digby reminded me of a post from, well, me, about which Americans are the most ignorant about the stuff politicians and pundits think matters most.

As the researchers explained in their report, “The extent of Americans’ misperceptions vary significantly depending on their source of news. Those who receive most of their news from Fox News are more likely than average to have misperceptions. Those who receive most of their news from NPR or PBS are less likely to have misperceptions. These variations cannot simply be explained as a result of differences in the demographic characteristics of each audience, because these variations can also be found when comparing the demographic subgroups of each audience.”

Almost shocking was the extent to which Fox News viewers were mistaken. Those who relied on the conservative network for news, PIPA reported, were “three times more likely than the next nearest network to hold all three misperceptions. In the audience for NPR/PBS, however, there was an overwhelming majority who did not have any of the three misperceptions, and hardly any had all three.”

Looking at the misperceptions one at a time, people were asked, for example, if the U.S. had discovered the alleged stockpiles of WMD in Iraq since the war began. Just 11% of those who relied on newspapers as their “primary news source” incorrectly believed that U.S. forces had made such a discovery. Only slightly more — 17% — of those who relied on NPR and PBS were wrong. Yet 33% of Fox News viewers were wrong, far ahead of those who relied on any other outlet.

Likewise, when people were asked if the U.S. had “clear evidence” that Saddam Hussein was “working closely with al Queda,” similar results were found. Only 16% of NPR and PBS listeners/viewers believed that the U.S. has such evidence, while 67% of Fox News viewers were under that mistaken impression.

Overall, 80 percent of those who relied on Fox News as their primary news source believed at least one of the three misperceptions. Viewers/listeners/readers of other news outlets didn’t even come close to this total.

In other words, Fox News viewers are literally less informed about these basic facts. They have, put simply, been led to believe things that are simply not true. These poor dupes would have done better in this survey, statistically speaking, if they received no news at all and simply guessed whether the claims were accurate.

Goldberg is right; a lot of data suggests Americans are uninformed. But how many of Goldberg’s fellow conservatives are skewing the results to make the rest of us look bad?

I’ll take an upbraiding from a guy who regularly asks his idiot National Review readership for e-mailed research and who takes 11 years to complete a book right around the 15th of never.

  • It’s like this: Does 456 x 567 = 258,555? Yes or No?

    No. And I feel sorry for you if you did the whole calculation, since just looking at it you know it’s wrong as the ones place unit must be a 2 (6 x 7 = 42). Since it’s a five in the one’s place, you know the answer’s wrong, stop calculating.

    Most honest Americans know Bush is not the right answer for the ones place. Further calculation, from knowing Reid’s name to boning up on House Rules Committee arcana won’t change the answer.

    Conservatives like Goldberg carry out the whole 6 digit calculation but still get the wrong answer.

  • Sometimes I think the Faux viewers are really so ignorant. They just lie to pollsters to support their wingnut agendas.

    For instance, they believe that finding 500 1980’s era saran and mustard gas artillery shells DOES prove that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction in 2002.

    And they think that it is important to SAY that Saddam had operational ties to al Qaeda, even if they know it’s not true.

    After all, for a wingnut, if the Vice President says it is true, it might well be. After all, he sees intelligence that we don’t get to.

    It’s nice to know that two-thirds of America get the “Truthiness” of the U.S. Attorneys purge.

    Remember, the scandel is not the eight who were fired, it’s the 86 (we’ll leave Fitzgerald out) who are such “loyal Bushies” that they were not fired. We already know they persecute Democrats at four times the rate as Republican’ts.

  • while most americans are focused on family and jobs, most of us do recognize the smell of a rotting corpse.

  • Sung to the Tune of Puff the Magic Dragon:

    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,
    Other Chicken Hawks loved that ignorant puff,
    And brought him gigs and paying jobs and other fancy stuff. oh

    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,
    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,

    Together they would jab at the tubes like twisted swords
    Delusion kept out facts that nipped on Jonah’s words,
    Silly dupes and wieners would bow wheneer they came,
    While Lefty Blogs would flip the bird when Jonah squealed out his name. oh!

    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,
    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,

    A pundit writes (seemingly) forever but not so Chicken Hawks
    Raving tactless and being factless make way for other things (like reality)
    One grey night it happened, Chicken Hawks came no more
    And Jonah that flighty pundit, his columns were a snore.

    His head was bent in sorrow, freedom fries fell like rain,
    Jonah desperately decided to play the Rove numbers game.
    Without his life-long friends, Jonah was never so lame,
    So Jonah that flighty pundit sadly let delusion cripple his brain. oh!

    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,
    Jonah, the chubby pundit lived by the sea
    And typed in the deluded bliss in a land far from Reality,

  • The devolution of the argument:

    – I am right: the polls show it
    – I am right: the poll is an outlier
    – I am right: this one poll out of six proves it
    – I am right: the librul media is twisting the polls
    – I am right: Fox agrees with me
    – I am right: everybody knows that the pollsters are libruls
    – I am right: the polls mean nothing – the people are no-good know-nothings

  • Jonah Goldberg: even when Senate Democrats agree that there is no actual evidence that Gonzales did anything improper.

    Statements like that from Republihacks have really annoyed me in the press coverage of the prosecutor purge, and are too often left unchallenged by corporate media.

    The “problem” of Carol Lam expressed the day after search warrants were executed in the Cunningham/Foggo/Wilkes investigation, clearly unethical pressure from Sen. Domenici on David Iglesias, the bogus prosecution of an official under Wisconsin’s Democratic governor. These are all examples of alleged improper conduct in the Justice Department and/or White House, but it’s being treated as “just politics” as the media is fixated on the survival of Gonzales.

  • Lance (#3), Truthiness will suffice as the substance of things hoped for, and the evidence of things not seen.

    A mutation has taken place between religious and political faith. God is always right. God is a conservative. Therefore, conservatives are always right. Stop bothering them with your secular humanist, scientific mumbo-jumbo. They will believe what they feel (under threat of eternal damnation) they’re required to believe and ignore that which they deem poisonous to their faith.

    As for the minority who possess the skills to use a calculator, they will insist on a result of xxx,xx5 because they’re cynical, narcissistic bastards using the idiot masses to bend whatever equation they choose to their will.

  • I wonder what percentage of people would like to beat the living crap out of any lying scumbag pundit who helped trick them into supporting the worst strategic mistake in US history?

    I’m guessing it would be a large percentage.

  • Keep it simple. You could no NOTHING about the whole scandal, and then just watch about one hour of the Gonzalez hearing, and you could be fairly well certain that something is incredibly wrong with whatever is happening at the DOJ, and it starts at the top.

    Or am I missing something? Did we just decide that incredible incompetence is ok at such high ranking positions, because our supreme leader has set the bar so low???

    Good grief.

  • I actually spend a lot of time thinking about the issue of public opinion and what the American public actually “knows” or understands. Hey…I have a long commute.

    Anyway, I’ve come to the belief that it does not matter how deep Americans’ knowledge is on the course of events. All that matters is the overall ‘feel’ they have of the issue. This ‘feel’ is developed over time from hearing news reports, reading newspapers and articles and MOST importantly, talking to friends and relatives and exchanging opinions. Sadly, this has worked against us progressives for the past 6 years because of the fact that the Republican’t noise machine is so adept at controlling the message (and of course, Fox’s implication in murdering the facts) and some Americans willingness to be swayed by it. That’s why so much of America buys into the “liberal” media belief.

    However, the drip-drip-drip of the war and the constant drumbeat of scandal this administration has been able to churn out has finally reached a point where most Americans are now aware that something is not quite right….much like when a truck is idling outside your window while you are working (or watching TV)…what’s that bothersome noise?

    As the saying goes…if it looks like a duckjob and sounds like a duckjob…

  • I think that a great many Americans coast along on general worldviews rather than mastery and evaluation of political facts.

    The most widely accepted paradigm over the last quarter century has been primarily the result of hard work and great success by the right-wing & fundamentalist noise machines: “christian values are good, taxes are bad, democrats are weak on defense, liberals are bad, the media is liberal”, and so on.

    These paradigms can change, sometimes slowly and sometimes with surprising quickness. The majority routinely leaned toward supporting Democrats after going through the New Deal and WWII with Roosevelt, but “yellow-dog” southern Democrats became Republican after LBJ pushed civil rights, and the midwestern middle class became significantly more Republican after becoming comfortable with Reagan over eight years.

    If there is any justice in the world, the totality of the corruption and incompetence that surrounds the Bush regime will breach public awareness in an unpleasant enough way to turn people against Republicans for a decade or so.

  • I don’t know what Jonah Goldberg is complaining about. If the electorate were more informed he’d be out of work.

  • The hard work and character that allows one to give another the benefit of the doubt is wholly absent from this Administration. In fact, a better argument could be made that their actions actually worked to sabotaged any hope or prospects they may have to garner that benefit.

    I’m sure in large part the public is no longer willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on any issue presented, excuse they may have, or defense of a matter. Assuming that a large number of folks don’t have a clue about the attorney purge scandal, that’s probably what’s at play in these polls.

    The sad thing is, the people are right not give any benefit to this group of hucksters. And, like it or not, it is a sad thing to not be able to believe a single thing your government tells you.

    That’s a recipe for societal cynicism, and there’s far too much cynicism already.

  • But, Jonah, Republicans WANT the public to be uninformed. That’s why you fund Fox News. It hardly seems fair to lie to the public so industriously, and then complain because people don’t know what’s going on.

    Sheesh.

  • CB, Goldberg’s case is anything but intellectually consistent: dismissing popular opinion because the electorate is uninformed dismantles our entire system of government.

    With a little reformulation: “So, we are supposed to believe that 53% of Americans have studied the details of Presidential Candidate X’s platform….Are these the same people who couldn’t pick Pelosi out of a lineup?”

    Which is it, Jonah: do we have a democracy or not?

  • Goldberg would do well to discuss a little bit about just how much Gonzalez knows about the constitution, Bush about basic civics.

    They appear to me to not have a clue about those things.

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