Hillary asks, ‘What does Hillary want?’

I was talking to some friends early last night, and they asked what I expected Hillary Clinton to do and say when she took the stage in NYC. At that point, it was already clear that Barack Obama had clinched the Democratic nomination, so it was really a matter of how Clinton would handle the end of a long, difficult process, and how Clinton would address coming this close to winning, before finishing just shy of her goal.

I was actually pretty confident that I knew exactly what Clinton would do. Just a few hours earlier, campaign chairman Terry McAuliffe, Clinton’s right hand man and enthusiastic surrogate, told a national television audience that once Obama reaches the magic number of 2,118 delegates, Clinton will “congratulate him and call him the nominee.” Well, Obama had reached and passed the threshold. The race was over. It was easy to imagine Clinton going out on a high note, reminding everyone of her class and dignity, and taking the initial steps to heal some wounds, rebuild some bridges, and bring like-minded allies back together.

But if Clinton has proved anything over the last 16 months of campaigning, it’s that she’s a fighter. And last night, the lights may have gone out on her presidential chances, but her drive to keep going anyway remains strong. Indeed, last night, Clinton’s remarks weren’t conciliatory, they were defiant.

Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton took the stage before supporters Tuesday night and finally asked the question that so many people had been posing: “What does Hillary want?”

She listed some policy goals and demanded respect for her supporters. But she did not really answer her own question, demurely suggesting instead that it was up to her backers to advise her by e-mail on what she should do next.

What the crowd gathered at Baruch College in Manhattan for her final primary night celebration wanted was clear, from those outside chanting “Denver, Denver,” urging her to go all the way to the party’s convention in August, to those inside interrupting her speech with shouts of “Yes, she will! Yes, she will!”

And while Mrs. Clinton reminisced about her campaign and talked of a need to unite the party, she did not concede, and indeed did not acknowledge that her rival, Senator Barack Obama, had passed the threshold of delegates needed to secure the nomination.

She personally posed the question: “What does Hillary want?” But once her speech was over, the answer to the inquiry was less than clear.

She, of course, literally answered the question…

“Well, I want what I have always fought for in this whole campaign. I want to end the war in Iraq. I want to turn this economy around. I want health care for every American. I want every child to live up to his or her God-given potential. And I want the nearly 18 million Americans who voted for me to be respected, to be heard and no longer to be invisible.”

…but that doesn’t offer any indications of what Clinton is actually prepared to do now that she’s lost the race for the nomination.

In this sense, we’re in the midst of a vaguely surreal campaign dynamic. For nearly a year and a half, the biggest hurdle between Obama and the nomination was Hillary Clinton. Now that the race is over and Obama’s the nominee, his next biggest challenge is still Hillary Clinton.

Indeed, for those of us expecting a graceful farewell speech, Clinton’s remarks were a bit of a curveball. It was almost as if news of Obama’s victory hadn’t reached them yet. McAuliffe introduced her as the “next president of the United States.” Clinton congratulated Obama, not for winning, but for running a great race. At one point she said, “No matters what happens in this race…” as if the race remains unresolved. Clinton added that she would be “consulting with supporters and party leaders, to determine how to move forward,” as if she was still pondering how to launch a comeback. Tom Petty’s “I Won’t Back Down” played as Clinton smiled and waved. The Clinton campaign sent an email to supporters referring to the campaign in the present tense.

As Dana Goldstein put it, “The more I think about it, the more it seems that Hillary’s entire speech was manufactured to rile up her supporters — instead of priming them to shift their allegiance to Obama. Yes, there’s a situation with Michigan and Florida. But is it really fair for Clinton to claim that her 18 million supporters nationwide have been made ‘invisible?’ Who’s supposed to be the bad guy here, scary Howard Dean? Clinton is offering more fighting rhetoric. But the fight should be over.”

Ezra added, “In the first episode of the BBC comedy Coupling, Steve decides he’s going to break up with his partner Jane. He steels up his courage, strides over to her, and makes his pitch. ‘I’m going to put this very simply. It’s over between us,’ he says. She looks at him quizzically. ‘You want us to split up?’ she asks. ‘Yes,’ replies Steve. ‘Yes I do.’ She looks at him sweetly. ‘I don’t accept.’ Tonight, the Democratic Party essentially told Clinton that it was over. Obama crossed the magic delegate threshold and captured, for all intents and purposes, the nomination. Clinton had run a remarkable race, and come inches from securing the nomination, but she had lost. And tonight, Clinton took the stage in New York, and said, in effect, ‘I don’t accept.'”

Dana Milbank said Clinton “graciously pretended to win.”

I suspect this is about two angles — retiring the campaign’s considerable debt and pushing for the VP slot. We’ll learn more about both soon enough.

Stepping back, though, Clinton must be severely disappointed, but no one, anywhere, can say she didn’t fight aggressively enough or work hard enough. She put everything she had on the line, and came extremely close to pulling it off. Every time Clinton would get knocked down, she’d get right up again, proving that her reputation for toughness and tenacity is well deserved.

The race just ended 12 hours ago, so it’s going to take some time to make good-faith efforts to restore some party unity. Once Clinton concedes — which, one assumes, should be fairly soon — I just hope both camps remember that respect is a two-way street. Obama sounded the right note last night, acknowledging Clinton’s exemplary record and steadfast spirit. Clinton may have chosen a different path last night, but I’m confident that she’ll sound a similar note. Any minute now.

I hope you’re right. It’s too bad she went out the way she did last night, but in the long run it’s important to have her on the Democratic team. I hope she pivots soon.

  • “Well, I want what I have always fought for in this whole campaign. I want to end the war in Iraq. I want to turn this economy around. I want health care for every American.”

    If that’s the case, then why are you intentionally getting your supporters so pissed off that they want to vote for McCain — who’ll prolong the war in Iraq, keep the economy going in the same direction, and scuttle efforts for universal health care — rather than for the Democrat who’ll push for all those things you say you want?

    Insane.

  • I hate to be the one to break it to you, but the race ended weeks ago. She has known for quite some time that she would be losing the delegate race and I think “stubborn” and “selfish” apply more than “defiant” and “fighter”.

    I appreciate that you’re trying to put a brave face on this, Steve, but frankly I was disappointed with Clinton last night–again. We can always hope she will come around–as you suggested–but she really missed an opportunity last night to show some class and grace, even if she hadn’t officially suspended her campaign.

  • I beg to differ. I watched Clinton’s speech and I thought it was gracious. I also thought it was a concession speech, which yes, didn’t actually concede. In a sense it was defiant, but not that she refused to recognize defeat. I think it was a defiant “up yours” to the media and the pundits. I think it was her way of saying “I lost, but the media and the pundits are not going to dictate to me when I formally concede.” I think she will concede in her own way and time in the next few days. For two years the media and the punditry have tried to control the presidential race (in both parties) and I think her defiance was for them.

  • Like John Cleese with a monstrous big sword and a gigantic black tin bucket on his head, Hillary Clinton stood in front of every other Democratic candidate for President in ’08 declaring ringingly, “None shall pass”.

    Once upon a time, the kingdoms of the Earth were all laid out before her. The Democratic nomination process for 2008 was to be a coronation of Queen Hillary I, First Woman President of the United States of America. The Democratic party would cement its grip on power once more, patronage, power and influence would flow to its wealthiest donors, and vengeance would be Hillary’s and Bill’s. And oh, it would be sweet.

    But that was then, and this is now. Where Senator Obama offers hope for the future and a gracious hand to a defeated opponent, Senator Clinton clings gracelessly to her past.

    By ‘making no decisions tonight’, Senator Clinton may believe she is doing many things — saving face, preserving maximum bargaining power for the VP slot on Senator Obama’s ticket, keeping her campaign’s hopes alive, just in case a dinosaur-killer hits the Earth between now and August, or now and November. (Then, as the human race feels its collective skin boiling off its collective bones in the massive cloud of superheated steam that will sweep the globe, she can raise her fist victoriously in the air and declare that yes, it’s true, SHE is now the Democratic nominee for President. And if she manages to outlast everyone else on some mountaintop somewhere, then, yes, indeed, she will be the First Woman President of the United States, finally. Her tenacity will have paid off, and the last laugh will be hers.)

    Every vote must be counted, except the ones that weren’t for Senator Clinton. The fight to seat the full Florida and Michigan delegations was the equivalent of the Civil Rights struggles of the 60s or the battle against slavery, as long as it would benefit Senator Clinton. Obama was an elitist who thought you hunted ducks with six guns and that the American people were bitter, said the whiskey drinkin’, shotgun totin’ Senator Clinton.

    And now, like a limbless torso somehow comically upright on its severed stumps, Senator Clinton shrills desperately at her rapidly receding opponent’s victorious rear profile, “Oh, runnin’ away, is it? Come back! I’ll bite your legs off!”

    Perhaps, like JFK before her, Senator Clinton had hopes and dreams of turning Washington, D.C. into a modern day Camelot.

    Camelot. Camelot.

    Unfortunately, Senator Clinton, it’s only a model.

    For the last many months, Senator Clinton has done her best to stay on the road — not because she had any real hope of getting to her original destination, but simply so that she, like any petulant driver, could make sure nobody else got by her.

    Her gracious opponents refer to her courage, her drive, her tenacity. The word they want is hubris, although Senator Obama is too kind to say it and Senator McCain isn’t sure how to pronounce it.

    Fortunately, it no longer matters. Senator Clinton is still stubbornly, truculently, petulantly sitting in the middle of the road… but Senator Obama has now, finally, gotten around her and is speeding onward to his destination.

    Maybe she still figures she can get him to come back and pick her up, and she can ride shotgun. My personal feelings are she’s long since ruined any chance she had at that, but you never know how these things will work out.

    In the end, though, there was no coronation, and Senator Clinton was not invincible.

    So be it.

  • Where does your confidence that HRC will do the right thing come from? That speech last night was a disgrace. It exhibited a total lack of class and a Bush-like inability to acknowledge reality. She continued to use lines designed to de-legitimate Obama as the nominee – she has received more votes than anyone else, the voters in SD had the “last word,” she won the popular vote. Specious attacks, of course. But this has been par for the course for HRC for a long time. At this point, the burden of proof is definitely on anyone who wants to make the case that HRC cares about the fate of the Democratic party or anything beyond her own narcissism and personal ambition.

  • The answer is obvious…Hiding behind all the noble platitudes, Hillary wants Hillary.

  • If Hillary wanted the VP nod she’s going about it in a really odd way.

    She should have spent last night talking about John McCain and what a huge mistake he would be for America. She should have shown what she can bring to Obama’s campaign for President.

  • Good points, Steve. I’m an enthusiastic Obama supporter and i’ve been ready for this thing to be over for weeks, but i didn’t see anything wrong with Hillary’s speech last night. One thing we have to remember is that she did win one of the states yesterday and had every right to revel in that. I thought the tone of the speech, more so than the words, conveyed the sense that she knows it’s over. But why should she concede immediately? Just because all the cable blowhards think she has some evil plot in the works? I expect she’ll do it in a day or two and that will be that. I was so irritated by the pundits last night who couldn’t let go of their Hillary obsessions, i started to think that she shouldn’t let it go either, if only to make them all lose their marbles.

  • “The race ended weeks ago.”

    She won three out of the last four primaries handily, including one Obama campaigners had counted in their column as a sure thing (South Dakota) in spite of endorsements for
    Obama by all major politicos in the state. If you were a true democrat, ie, one who believes in democracy, you would recognize thatshe had a right to continue until all states were heard from.

  • MW,

    A concession speech where she didn’t concede? Maybe that should clue you in to what else was missing. She gave her finger to Obama, the process, and everyone else, while creating yet another self-pitying meme–this time about her supporters being “invisible.” It was not only ungracious, it was disingenuous, calculated, and cold-hearted. Very disappointing.

  • BTW, none of this should have been a surprise to anyone.

    The math for her became essentially impossible after Wisconsin.

  • Let Hillary mourn the loss of her dream. The first stage is denial.

    “I Won’t Back Down”? OMG – this is serious.

    Several talking heads have used the phrase “alternate universe” to describe Hillary’s rally last night. It seemed apt.

    Obama will be making a horrible mistake if he picks Hillary for VP. He will look like he isn’t in control of his own administration. And the perception will be correct.

    After some time has passed, I expect Hillary to put 100% into getting Obama elected. As angry as I am with both Clintons, I don’t believe that they are evil enough to allow McCain to be elected. When their egos aren’t so deeply involved, they really do care about making this country better, even if they don’t always go about it in the right way.

    Having sabotaged the Obama campaign, what would Hillary’s chances be in 2012?

    Zero. Absolute zero.

  • the whole ordeal reminds me of ye olde Nancy Kerrigan – Tonya Harding Olympic scandal. Harding surrounded herself with dumb physical thugs who tried to handicap her opponent, then asked for a “do-over” becuse her laces became undone. Clinton surronded herself with snarky verbal thugs who tried to handicap Obama with innuendo, condescension, and rule-bending-if-not-breaking, and now Clinton wants to push the meme that the end results aren’t the end results, and a do-over is still possible, and she deserves one.

    Let’s hope that, unlike that scandal, Obama gets the gold.

    And that Clinton doesn’t pose for Playboy.

  • She won three out of the last four primaries handily, including one Obama campaigners had counted in their column as a sure thing (South Dakota) in spite of endorsements for
    Obama by all major politicos in the state.

    That’s because Obama has been running against McCain for some time now.

    HRC has been off the radar for some time.

    It’s like when you put in the 2nd string when you’re up big in the 4th quarter. Sure the other team scores, but it’s all moot.

  • I suspect this is about two angles — retiring the campaign’s considerable debt and pushing for the VP slot.

    If so, she is either extremely stupid, or, scarier, delusional. If she wants to be VP, she should shut up. Now.

  • While she unfortunately didn’t outright concede, I think it overstates the case to say she didn’t acknowledge Obama had won. When she said “I won’t be making any decisions tonight” – there would be no decisions to make if she were still viable. You’d never hear a frontrunner use that phraseology.

    She may be trying to maximize leverage for a VP slot (if so, I’m not sure why anyone at Camp Clinton thinks this helps), she may be trying to maximize leverage for a role at Convention, help with debts, and input on platforms, VP etc. That would be a much more reasonable pitch.

    But the actual words notwithstanding, I thought her speech had more of a nostalgic tone than a defiant one. I think she knows it is over. Whether she can bring herself to actually say those words out loud is another matter altogether.

  • I’m sure Yogi Berra has something to say about Hilary’s efforts. I’m waiting for him to speak on this matter for the benefit of all Americans. Yes, maybe Yogi’s observation will make the best sense of just what Ms. Clinton is up to! -Kevo

  • Stay the Course

    For those who think Hillary is politically savvy, and that she’s significantly different from Bush, just remember that last night she thanked her supporters for “staying the course”.

  • It really was a disappointment from a woman who’s made a career these last few months of disappointing.

    She had an opportunity to go out like a hero, a pillar of progressivism, showing that she holds the Democratic principles of justice, fairness, compassion and community above everything else. She had a chance to start moving her supporters toward the larger, critical goal of electing a Democratic president this fall. Instead, she took the opportunity to be small, petty and self-focused once again–and, by pulling a Nixon Checkers moment with the “write in and tell me how much you love me–and incidentally send me money to retire my campaign debt while I pretend it’s still an active campaign” business, she signaled that she wants to keep a tight emotional hold on her supporters rather than help defeat McCain and the policies that will badly hurt those same supporters if he’s elected.

    She and Bill really are lone wolves now; they’ve cut themselves off from the party.

    We’ve said it many times the past few months: adversity brings out people’s characters, and what we’ve seen from her and her husband as it dawned on them that they were losing this race wasn’t a flattering reflection of their characters. But last night she was determined to make sure that any last shred of respect for her–and any chance of her becoming VP–was totally obliterated. Is she planning on spending the rest of her life, and her cut-short-by-her-own-hand political career, sustained by spite when she could have risen to new opportunities and new public regard by doing the right thing?

  • I know how Hillary feels. It is tough and hard to take. It is so hard to convince yourself that your goals do not align with other people’s. Like that time Cindy Crawford got a restraining order against me…

  • Oh, please, I have had enough by now of the self-righteous high-minded small-d democratic line. This is about the nomination of the party and at this point it is most assuredly not about free elections, slavery, disenfranchisement, small-d democracy or anything else other than the “horse race” to become the Democratic (big D) nominee. It’s about delegates, pledged and super. And it has been over for weeks. Maybe you missed night after night of the same explanations about how the math was stacked against her. I mean the real math, not the math she made up to pretend she still had a chance.

    “she had a right to continue until all states were heard from”

    Yep, and now what’s the excuse? All this time to consider the overwhelmingly most likely scenario and she is making her decisions based on an Internet poll of her supporters? It’s just more selfish grandstanding and manipulation of nice folks like you and dedicated people like Mary, bless her deranged loyal heart.

  • #16
    Over only in the view of Obama partisans who could not wait for a a dignified outcome and
    and have been pushing for other legitimate candidates to get out of the way for them since February.

  • For those who say she needs time to grieve, that time is past. Last night was the last opportunity to say, in prime time with all the media watching, that it was a hard-fought race but Obama won and she would enthusiastically support him to ensure defeat of McCain in the fall.

    Instead she tossed up her litany of reasons why it was really she who won, and utterly failed to congratulate Obama on a truly historic victory. (Note: it would have been historic if she had won as well, and I have zero doubt that Obama would have congratulated her properly.)

    She should have given him the opening to say “thank you Hillary for your offer of support in our effort to elect a Dem to the White House in November.” Hell, she should have flown to St. Paul and introduced him. Instead, she threw more red meat to her more rabid supporters.

    Here is what the normally very calm James Fallows said last night:

    Way to unify the party, HRC!

    03 Jun 2008 10:01 pm

    You HAVE LOST the nomination. There are NO MORE primaries. And you’re urging your supporters to nurse their bitter feelings on your web site, and keep selling their bikes to give you money that you’ll spend on… what? The unseemliness — and, yes, destructiveness — of this is too obvious to mention, though perhaps not obvious enough to have occurred to you.

    This is a new low.

    Update: Having an (intended?) effect already. Maybe he’ll get going, but first 10 minutes of Obama’s speech seem oddly off-his-stride and not looking as sunnily victorious as he should at this moment. Likely hypothesis: what he just heard in Clinton’s speech.

    Update-update: Recovers somewhat from minute 15 on, finishes very strong. Still, it seems undeniable that he spent his first few minutes looking like something other than the man-who-has-just-clinched thanks in part to the slap he had just received from HRC.
    http://jamesfallows.theatlantic.com/archives/2008/06/way_to_unify_the_party_hrc.php

  • This is part of a pattern that caused me to lose respect for Hillary. The gas tax holiday, the endless goalpost moving, the “he hasn’t passed the Commander-in-Chief test” then throwing out a VP offer…almost makes me think Rev. Pfleger was right…

  • I dunno. With McCain’s lush praise for her last night, and with her most rabid supporters saying they’ll vote McCain, wouldn’t surprise me if she ends up his VP. It would be damned fitting considering all the bad mojo she’s wreaked on the rest of us. I heard some head saying last night she wanted to be offered the position, but she has no intention of taking it. And if they agree to the “offer”, then she has to agree not to accept it because they have no intention of giving it to her. Anyone else hear that or was I just drunk and disorderly?

    Welcome to all the newly converted Obama supporters. Get on the bus! We saved you a seat 🙂 Even you Mary, if you could get your head out of your cleavage long enough to breathe the fresh air.

  • Ambassador to Antartica seems like a good post for Hillary. She could wear black and white pantsuits and fit right in.

  • ‘What does Hillary want?’

    She wants to be VP. Obviously.

    And the answer should be HELL NO.

    Anyone who can’t acknowledge reality (and the reality has been clear since she lost Texas) should not be considered for VP. Period.

  • Over only in the view of Obama partisans who could not wait for a a dignified outcome and
    and have been pushing for other legitimate candidates to get out of the way for them since February.

    Only the Obama partisans couldn’t wait for all the primaries to be over before declaring a nominee?

    Only the Obama partisans said this would be finished in February?

    I guess that makes Hillary Clinton an Obama partisan.

  • Adversity does indeed bring out people’s characters and she has shown guts and perserverance in spite of unprecedented personal attacks by the mainstream media and impatient “I want it now” Obama supporters> The sad part is that women have been a part of this as well.

  • As I listened to Hillary last night, I was thinking that Rachel Maddow remains right – she has no intention of conceding and plans to take this to the convention. Regardless of anything. Cause she’s a fighter. And something might happen to Obama.

    That is precisely what she set up last night by asking her “Denver, Denver, Denver” supporters to write in and tell her what to do.

  • One could argue that George Bush is a “fighter”. We’ve all seen how much damage that kind of egotistical blindness can do. I mean, rabid animals keep fighting, too. I’m tired of this being seen as a virtue.

    How about some integrity instead?

  • Over only in the view of Obama partisans who could not wait for a a dignified outcome and
    and have been pushing for other legitimate candidates to get out of the way for them since February.

    It was over in the view of anyone with a calculator, a calender of upcoming contests, and an understanding of proportional delegate allocation.

    She ran her campaign the way Rummy ran the Iraq war, with similar outcome.

  • Last night, Hillary told her audience to go to her website – so I did. Was curious about what her fans were saying. Of course, they were urging her to carry on and to take her cause to Denver. But, what surprised me most was that people are still giving money to her campaign, even though she has lost! I saw people giving $100, $50, $25 and some people who could only afford $10.

    I guess some people are so enthralled with Hillary they cannot accept the obvious. Maybe they believe that if they contribute money that something magical will happen and they can “save” Hillary.

    Truly strange.

  • CB: “I suspect this is about…pushing for the VP slot.

    extort verb 1. To obtain from another by coercion or intimidation. 2. To obtain favors by intimidation or misuse of authority.

  • Jesus Christ. A Human being should know when it’s beat. This just pisses me off to no end. Really? Hillary? Rieally? We’ll take Clark as VP. No Prob. Enjoy retiring your debt.

  • Has anyone seen any numbers on how many new Superdelegates have switched since the speeches last night. It looks like a lot, and according to DemConWatch there are at least four of five switches from Hillary.

  • I was disappointed that the Clinton campaign did not recognize the reality that she had lost and act with class.

    As she trumpets her recent wins, please keep in mind that as these primaries played out, Obama had already gone into General Election mode after Ohio and Texas ensured that there was no way that Clinton could catch him.

    As the Clinton campaign went into the “kitchen sink” strategy, going negative over Rezko, Wright, Ayers etc. please notice that the Obama campaign never mentioned Norman Hsu, Denise Rich, Rose Law records, the Bill Clinton foreign investor connections and terrorist Pardons etc. All things that the Republicans would have used. Instead Obama, knowing that he’d need to bring in Clinton supporters, took the negative hits without returning them. If he had played it like the Clinton campaign, she would not have run off anything close to this string of victories.

    It will be different in the final. He does not have to play nice like this with the McCain campaign and if McCain goes negative expect Obama to respond in kind, neutralizing the negative benefit.

  • On an historic evening when an African-American had just clinched the presidential nomination, his rival, Senator Hillary Clinton, gave a campaign speech. She offered some praise to Barack Obama for the strong campaign he had run, but carefully avoided the word. “won”.

    During the day, expecting Obama’s victory, Clinton’s campaign had stepped on the celebration of this milestone with, among other things, her statement that she was open to being the candidate for vice president. This gave extra meaning to her demand that the 18 million (sic) Americans who had voted for her must be respected.

    Hillary’s speech was before a few hundred donors and supporters in a basement gymnasium at New York’s Baruch College. (Didn’t Obama once tell us that the word Barack was a form of the word Baruch?) With no television monitors there, some in the audience certainly had not heard that Obama had just won the nomination. They surely would not get this news from her.

    Terry McAuliffe introduced Clinton as the “next president” and her speech was a mixture of farewell thank yous to supporters and campaign workers and vows to keep standing up and fighting for her beliefs and the American people. The Senator again presented her case that she was the stronger candidate and argued that she had won the popular vote, a notion disputed by the Obama campaign. She said she would work for party unity, but she had already been including this in her stump speech. No congratulations to Obama, no endorsement, no concession.

    And no graciousness.

    homer http://www.altara.blogspot.com

  • HECKUVA JOB, MRS. CLINTON!

    […] Hours before the polls closed Tuesday in the final two Democratic presidential primaries, the Republican National Committee began circulating a video of Hillary Clinton questioning Barack Obama’s qualifications to be commander-in-chief, and acknowledging John McCain has this important presidential credential. […]

    […] An RNC official tells CNN to expect to see more of Republicans highlighting Clinton’s critical comments of Obama as the campaign now turns to the general election phase. “We will use it repeatedly,” the official said. […]

  • Hell, I’d donate to her myself if I could earmark it to pay off the small business owners she’s been stiffing since January rather than to replenish her and Bill’s personal coffers. See what a unifier I am? Now you try it, Hillary.

    Adversity does indeed bring out people’s characters and she has shown guts and perserverance in spite of unprecedented personal attacks by the mainstream media and impatient “I want it now” Obama supporters

    As I have noted here before, tenacity unaccompanied solid judgment or objective principle is not a virtue. Instead, it’s selfish stubbornness, and it results in moral disasters like the Bush administration. If Clinton wanted good things for this country as much as she wants to run it, that perseverance would pay off big. Instead, she’s chosen to recast her legacy in this terribly unflattering light. So disappointing.

  • Has anyone seen any numbers on how many new Superdelegates have switched since the speeches last night. It looks like a lot, and according to DemConWatch there are at least four of five switches from Hillary.

    I don’t know how many came after the speeches, but Obama got nearly 70 yesterday, including quite a few switches from Clinton. I expect there will be many more today.

  • “What does Hillary want?”

    Anyone who does not understand that she actually won just does not understand the new math! Hillary knows and does not comprehend why others cannot accept ‘the reality’ that no n*gg*r is going to win the presidency and that she is the ‘great white hope’ of the democratic party.

    It is therefore understandable that she wants Obama to accept ‘the reality’ and withdraw from the race.

  • The headlines are saying “Obama Proclaims Himself Winner”. That sums it up. Obama has named himself the winner, just as he has been doing all along. Obama supporters have claimed this is all over for months now. But you don’t win by elbowing out your opponents. Clinton does not have quit on Obama’s schedule, or anyone else’s. If Obama is the obvious and presumptive winner, why is Clinton still winning primaries? People are voting in those primaries, and not for Obama.

    CNN last night showed that Obama will have difficulty beating McCain without Clinton’s voters but wins easily with a “dream ticket.” Clinton is not the one angling for VP and has denied that talk. It is all coming from Obama people because it is so obvious that he needs her on his ticket and cannot win without her. All the “hell, no” talk just alienates Clinton supporters more and exemplifies the small-boy pique of his campaign. If Wright’s mentorship was his search for the long-gone daddy missing from his life, Clinton symbolizes his ambivalence toward his mommy. He wants to cut the apron strings in the worst way, but he is still dependent on her. Unfortunately, this isn’t Obama’s family drama and the grown-up decision would be to do whatever strengthens the ticket and ensures victory in Nov. But I would be surprised if Clinton wanted to be VP.

    Obama’s current total includes 59 delegates he did not win but were wrongly accorded to him. I hope Clinton will take that to the convention, because a misappropriation of votes by a committee cannot be permitted without challenge. In the meantime, superdelegate endorsements are not votes. They are intentions to vote a particular way at the convention. Whether the delegates actually do so, remains to be seen. Obama needs to show that he can win in November, but so far he has made little headway against McCain. I understand that Obama is tired and wants to stop having to prove himself, but he will have to keep going until Nov, because the voters will expect him to prove himself until then. I think the superdelegates would be well advised to keep their options open until they see whether he can actually win the nomination by winning the hearts and minds of enough voters to be effective against McCain. He just hasn’t done that yet. Clinton’s speech and the outpouring of support from her 18 million voters should be evidence of that — perhaps that is what Clinton is trying to tell the superdelegates. If this were truly over for her, Clinton would not still be able to gain such support from voters. While she can, Obama is in trouble and so is the party.

  • H. Clinton egged the South Dakota folks on with her claim We will have victory in Iraq, I guess that statement in a nutshell deomonstrates her very strong Republican leaning. She cannot be trusted to toe the Democratic line. She cannot be trusted to budget money. she cannot be trusted period. She is only interested in her agenda for Hillery Clinton. She is not interested in Americans and America’s needs. She uses rhetoric to say otherwise. Just like the Bush Administration she has no substance to the truth.

  • Michael, it was Montana that permitted cross-over voting and Independents gave Obama his victory there. In SD, the voting was by registered Democrats only and Clinton won by 10 pts. That exemplifies Obama’s problem.

  • “Obama has named himself the winner, just as he has been doing all along.”

    Holy cow. Are you serious???

    Go get some fresh air or something. Obama won the Democratic nomination by a comfortable margin and he did it following every rule in every book.

    It is over.

  • The headlines are saying “Obama Proclaims Himself Winner”. That sums it up.

    Really? I just did a Google News search for that exact prhrase, and there’s not a single newspaper headline out there that used that. Not one.

    You’re batshit crazy and you live in a universe all your own, Mary. That sums it up.

  • There’s been this meme about handling Hillary gently, being patient, giving her time to grieve, etc. Frankly, I think that’s a bunch of horseshit, and pretty sexist. If she were male, would this be an issue? Truth be told, anyone tough enough to run for the Presidential nomination should be tough enough to handle losing like an ADULT! Instead, it sounds like she’s in her last month of pregnancy and folks are worried about causing her to go into early labor.

  • You know, Mary actually illustrates what I think is the greatest crime the Clintons are committing. They are promoting this kind of emotional and delusional thinking among their supporters, who are clearly vulnerable and need leadership to help them begin to wrap their minds around their loss.

    What kind of sociopath treats people this way? A Clinton.

  • Where’s IFP when you need that dose of snark?

    Mary, what you and your candidate fail to grasp is that her campaign tactics — including last night’s speech — have done irreparable damage the Clinton Brand. No less than her husband’s legacy (which I found to be near great and thought would improve with the aging of history) has been diminished by her candidacy. Her failure to accept reality, just as reflected in your comment, smacks of hypocrisy. Anyone who ever played a school yard game hates the sore loser who constantly changes the rules to favor herself.

    And so it was, as a I sat there last night and watched her graceless speech in horror, that I thought that there might actually be a psychological disturbance with this person who seemingly cannot accept reality. This completed a difficult journey for me that started with great admiration for both Clintons to a revulsion at their sight on my Tee Vee (miss you Ed).

  • it was Montana that permitted cross-over voting and Independents gave Obama his victory there. In SD, the voting was by registered Democrats only and Clinton won by 10 pts. That exemplifies Obama’s problem.

    You win the general election by putting together a coalition of your base and independents.

    You need (I) voters to win. If you only appeal to democrats you’re doomed (see Kerry, J.F.).

    I’m not seeing the problem here.

  • Dear Mary,
    Should Senator McCain win in November, it will be thanks to people like yourself. While it’s certainly your right to hold your views, those views will very likely get me sent back to Iraq several more times and possibly on to Iran. And God only knows what harm will come to the economy or the healthcare system, that your candidate says she wants fixed, should Senator McCain get into the White House. I’ll remain civil for now. Don’t expect any civility from me or the rest of the party should the worst occur.

  • There’s been this meme about handling Hillary gently, being patient, giving her time to grieve, etc. Frankly, I think that’s a bunch of horseshit, and pretty sexist. If she were male, would this be an issue? Truth be told, anyone tough enough to run for the Presidential nomination should be tough enough to handle losing like an ADULT! Instead, it sounds like she’s in her last month of pregnancy and folks are worried about causing her to go into early labor.

    This is bothering me, too. With the exception of the certifiable B1 Bob Dornan, who still hasn’t conceded to Loretta Sanchez nine years later, I can’t think of a male candidate who hasn’t been able to pull up his socks and concede as soon as he lost the race. You do the right, grown-up thing first. Then you do your grieving in private. If you’re not totally delusional and thus recognized that you were going to lose as soon as it became apparent (in this case, months ago), you get the first part of your grieving done before the concession.

    Instead, everyone is treating Clinton like a loaded gun with a hair trigger or a balky mule who has to be gentled along. While her own erratic behavior has certainly encouraged these comparisons, they’re not exactly flattering to someone who’s supposed to be the tough and tenacious pro. James Carville’s “These things take time” comment last night was particularly condescending to Hillary: everyone in the campaign but Mark Penn (and, apparently, Hillary) has accepted that it’s over, so what Carville was saying is that she was too delicate and weak to make those phone calls to Rendell, Corzine, etc. over the past few days.

    We’re supposed to think that someone who’s too much of a fainting flower to handle a simple concession can handle the rough and tumble of a presidency?

  • At what point does her intransigence start to impact her career in the Senate?

    How pissed is Reid? How pissed is Dick Durbin.

    She hasn’t got much seniority in the Senate, if she’s not careful she might find herself not getting the committees she wants.

  • Steve you are too kind
    This isn’t over by a long shot

    DENVER DENVER DENVER is all you had to hear to know that Clinton is playing her supporters.

    Here is Clinton’s plan in a nutshell

    1. Feed her supporters red meat about “fighting”, “being the stronger candidate”
    2. Her supporters rally around her to stay and fight until Denver
    3. Clinton claims she cant leave the race b/c her supporters WANT her to stay and fight
    4. Repeat

    Clinton is playing everyone for a fool.
    Until she unequivocially says I support Obama as the Dem candidate she will haunt his every move until the convention.
    She will continue the process of distracting Americans from the case against McCain and once again suck up all the oxygen to feed her and her husband’s ego.
    Since DEM leadership is spineless this will go on all summer long.
    The longer she and her supporters take a adversarial position against Obama the harder it will be to mend fences and rally around him in the fall.
    If this primary has taught me anything about the Clinton’s its……
    Clinton’s first, party second, country third
    keep fighting b/c

  • Clinton’s speech could have been worse – “Alright Barack, I’m asking for the last time, do you want to be my Vice President or not? I’m not holding this open forever.”

    The incomprehensible die-hard support for Clinton (promising to vote for McCain rather than Obama) has me wondering whether those supporters are urging Hillary to continue in the hopes that Obama’s delegates and superdelegates will look at the their newspapers today, see big pictures of Obama under headlines saying things like “Obama’s the Nominee”, and realize “Oh my god, he’s black. How come I never noticed? What have we done? Is it too late to switch to Hillary???”

    At least, there’s not a lot of other reasoning that can lead a Democrat to urge Hillary to continue or to support McCain over Obama.

  • Mary sez:

    They are intentions to vote a particular way at the convention. Whether the delegates actually do so, remains to be seen.

    If you really believe that, then no nomination is ever or has ever been (after 1972) “won” until convention. So why did all of the candidates drop out all of those years? In theory, even pledged delegates have not “voted” until convention. Yet every prior nomination has been declared – by candidates, party officials, media – long before the convention and much sooner than this one.

    The reality is that the pledged delegates do not switch, because they are largely chosen by the campaigns they have pledged to, and are chosen for loyalty. The superdelegates also do not generally switch – they can wait and announce when they are certain, and there are political penalties for flip-flopping.

    So even the 59 delegates you complain of that were granted by committee (and recall that without that, Clinton would have 69 fewer delegates as well) have been more than replaced now by announcing superdelegates. Your argument that supers can change their mind may be technically true, but of no practical value: there has not been a single Obama-to-Clinton change (other than the one flaky super who has gone Clinton-Obama-Clinton) in at least 3 months if ever, all of the superdelegate momentum is to Obama.

    There is no non-deluded way to conclude anything but that this is over.
    The sooner everyone accepts that the better it is for the party, the country – and for the mental health of those presently in denial.

  • In fact, her obstinate, absurd speech has actually managed to ‘change perceptions’ in the way she’s tried to do. Had she conceded, or even announced she was ‘suspending her campain’ the headline for last night would have read

    OBAMA WINS NOMINATION.

    In fact, both the Washington POST and the NYT use the headline

    OBAMA CLAIMS nomination.

  • I hope Obama is able to be gracious in victory, but I keep getting reminded that Clinton is a fighter. As long as she’s fighting the best response is to keep the pressure on. If she’s not out by the end of the week, I’ll write the first $25 check to the primary challenger for Clinton’s senate seat. My hope is for the Clinton’s to fall in line and become team players, but they are keeping the door open for an ugly convention fight. Until that door is closed, watch out for the sucker punch.

  • The following scenario is purely fanciful — except for the first statement. (The date was chosen for no particular reason except it sounded good and was within the timestream.)
    The reason for the scenario is because the response will demonstrate just what she has done to her reputation — and to challenge her supporters to demonstrate why it isn’t possible, or to say what they’d do if it actually occurred.

    On July 18th, John McCain announces that, for reasons of health, he is dropping his campaign for the Presidency. The Republican leaders, either responding to the announcement or having caused it, look around for a replacement. The other candidates that had been running really were even worse than McCain. Gingrich refuses it. What are they to do?

    They get a great idea. They put in a call to Hillary, and offer her the nomination.

    And she says…

    (Please justify your answer.)

  • > If this were truly over for her, Clinton would not still be able to gain such support from voters. While she can, Obama is in trouble and so is the party.

    Mary, I think this is a great point — seriously, no snark — and it points out a big problem that many of us are having with Clinton’s behavior last night. We are afraid that the longer Hillary waits before wholeheartedly endorsing Obama, the more of her supporters will lose interest and end up not helping the Democrats win in November (either by voting for the other guy, or by not contributing in other ways).

    Hillary’s supporters have a lot of grievances right now, many of them well justified, about how their favorite candidate was treated by the media, by the party elders, and by supporters of other candidates. Last night would have been a great time for Hillary herself to tell those people it’s time — no, really, finally time this time — to start the healing process and move on towards unity and victory. Instead, she’s keeping the wounds open, at potentially great cost.

    Many of us are left to wonder why she is doing this, and can think of very few answers that are charitable. What does she have to gain from stretching this out, now that all the votes have been counted and the remaining superdelegates are all coming together behind Obama? This explains why terms like “extortion” and “sociopath” and, my favorite from the CNN commentators last night, “delusional narcissism,” are being bandied about. It’s seriously hard to think of another explanation.

  • I see Mary has decided to change the rules … AGAIN.

    Face it, Mary: Obama won MORE DELEGATES. And in this primary process, having MORE DELEGATES — by a long shot — is all that matters. Period. End of discussion.

    I also find it the height of hypocrisy that you and other Clinton folks whine like babies about “the will of the people!!” while simultaneously saying delegates who represent the will of the people can change what the will of the people dictated.

    In short, there is no sort of mental gymnastics you folks won’t perform to justify Clinton staying in the race. Yet, Obama has passed the delegate mark CLINTON HERSELF HAS SAID IS THE THRESHOLD. So why do keep doing it?

    I’m really starting to think a very small and way-vocal minority of Clinton supporters have GOPhilia — a mental disease that allows people to ignore all objective and certifiable reality when it impedes on their goals, beliefs or desires.

    I just hope Merck comes up with a pill for it by November …

  • Interestingly, the dynamic between Clinton and some of her supporters is exactly what Obama was talking about when he said “bitter”. They are bitter and are clinging to something they’re worried about losing (a safety blanket really), Clinton, and will be easily manipulated because of their bitterness. By either McCain or Clinton.

    They’re acting against their own interests just like many single issue voters.

  • Her speech was a disgrace. I have a feeling she will see her “army” melt away whether she eventually behaves with any shred of grace or not. The ghastly John McCain horror show last night illustrated in stark, jarring terms what is at stake in this election. I can’t believe there will be many clinton supporters who will sit out the election or throw their vote to John McCain as a hissy fit because Clinton lost the nomination. There wasn’t exactly an impressive turn out of her “army” at the Rules Committee meetin Barack Obama and John McCain will dominate the news as they face off. ThAmerican people will focus on that (and if last night is any indication, the choice for anyone concerned with the direction this nation is heading will be clear). Hillary clinton may try to stay in the spotlight, but she will be increasingly pushed to the back. she’s not the story. Only her wackiest supporters (the Taylor Marsh feaks) will cling to her.

  • She hasn’t got much seniority in the Senate, if she’s not careful she might find herself not getting the committees she wants. -Erik in Maine

    I’d like to think there are consequences for behavior like this, but then I remember Lieberman.

    Speaking of Lieberman, I’m starting to wonder how long it is before we have the ‘America for Hillary’ party.

  • I’d like to think there are consequences for behavior like this, but then I remember Lieberman.

    I was talking to Rep Tom Allen at the Maine Dem Convention last weekend.

    Lieberman is cut slack because the margin is small.

    If the Dems take some seats in the Senate, Joe is going to find himself off the plum committees.

  • Why would anyone nominate some 60 year old for VP who would be 68 and look even more like a prune than she does now, in 2016? Hillary and all the others who are being mentioned for VP are not going to get it. Not one of them could believably run for President in 2016. What we want is someone who can cement 8 years of Obama with 8 more years so the Right is thoroughly destroyed.

    Thank God, this means that there will be no more idiot Baby Boomers (said as a “war baby”) on the national ticket. The Least Generation is over.

  • Tom will you just stop these constant death-wishing comments.

    Just a short time we were, rightly, criticizing Hillary for even mentioning the question of assassination. How can we maintain this argument and not slap you down for calling for it. Of course you are only speaking rhetorically, exaggerating for impact. But people can so easily quote things out of context.

  • Speaking of Lieberman

    If there’s anyone who’s got Joe-mentum right now, it’s Hillary.

  • Tom, my reference to your comment is the one at 73. So many of your comments are like the one at 79 that I hate to challenge you, but I had to.

    (Btw, your analysis fits my candidate, Kathleen Sebelius, very nicely. She was already being spoken of as a candidate in the next open election.)

  • Jim:

    I don’t “death wish” the Clintons, but as a writer of horror movies, I know that the only way you get rid of the monster is to finish it off.

    Personally, I’d rather see those two senteneced to drift off into the sunset of a darkening sea, forgotten and ignored – the worst possible punishment you could give a par of psychopathic narcissists like them.

    BTW – you’re doing good posts over at that other place. (not mentioned by name since this is “the best place”)

  • Cleaver, could you try not to be an unmitigated asshole for one day? Today would be an especially good choice for that.

    Erik, I hope you’re right. At this point, Joey Leebs is like a kid destroying everything around him and daring his parents to punish him. Reid is the ineffective parent who mumbles, “Well, he’s always been high-strung…” and some such.

  • This just goes to sow how hard headed that Clinton is! She pushes ahead inpite of th fact that the Republicans have had since March to get ready for thir Presidential bid. So instead of concieding and heling to get a plan together for the big fight, Clinton takes knife swipes at the Demoratic party throat. We won’t win in fighting with each other! I can see this kind of mentality causing ajor problems when a President o Vice president doesnt know when to quite and do whats right for the people, To be honest I think now that she would lead our country to it’s doom to save her own pride, and her own opinion of what should be, seams kinda lie Moby Dick, can you ssay “Captian Clinton”

  • She isn’t going to concede. Obama will have to run a campaign against McSame until the convention while still watching his back for her next move, which she’s likely to pull there. I don’t know why people expect her to go graciously into the night. She thinks, like many of my former students, that trying really hard is the same as demonstrating competency.

  • I have to admit that part of me is hoping the Clintons keep this up.

    In the context of a still-ongoing campaign (never mind that it only continued because they didn’t have the sense or grace or class to abandon a hopeless cause), their truly astonishing narcissism and selfishness was somewhat obscured. But now the parade is over and the circus has left town… yet they’re still marching, shouting, strutting and flailing. It’s going to look increasingly silly; more and more objective observers and non-fanatical Clinton supporters are going to see this behavior for what it is.

    This is who they are. I do believe that at one time they were principled progressives; you don’t do what they did in the early ’70s without that mindset. But in the last 15 years, maybe earlier than that, they went around the bend in the pursuit of power. They’ve done vile things–I don’t mean “killing Vince Foster” or decorating the Xmas tree with crack pipes or any of the other vile nonsense their persecutors-turned-allies on the fringe Right alleged, but the destruction of Bill’s various floozies, the pardons, Hillary’s votes for All War, All the Time, Bill’s coddling of dictators and various other monsters during his post-presidential jet-setting.

    Rarely if ever have we seen a family like this in American politics, possessed as they are of the unshakable belief that the rules simply don’t apply to them–that they are so special and indispensable, so divinely ordained, that no misdeed is unforgivable.

    Well, maybe one other family. Which is the biggest reason I’m profoundly glad the Restoration died last night.

  • She isn’t going to concede. Obama will have to run a campaign against McSame until the convention while still watching his back for her next move, which she’s likely to pull there.

    If she’s not careful she’ll be the next Lyndon LaRouche.

  • “Clinton had run a remarkable race”

    Huh ?? I sent her money and she was my candidate until she and her brilliant staff ran HRC into the ground. All these extemely pro-HRC people are her creation, all the animosity, is hers. The news class of democrats swearing to vote R because they didn’t get their way, we can thank HRC for that non-sense too. Right now there are a bunch of democrats who still believe there is a race, again, created by HRC. So please spare me Steve, HRC ran a god awful campaign and the only reason she is still above water is because Rush Limbaugh and his “Operation Chaos” threw her a life preserver.

    And let us not forget Bill. My god, a year ago I would have sworn up and down that Bill was one of the greatest men of my generation, now, hell no. Sure he was a great president, but damn, some of the wingnuttery of the 90’s doesn’t seem as far off as I used to think. It’s a god damn shame and it all boils down to HRC running one of the most pathetic Democratic primary campaigns ever. Has anyone ever sided with the republicans in their bid for the democrat nomination ? If so it’s many years past. She went from ‘shoe-in’ to ‘get lost’ in less then 6 months.

    HRC & Bill had better live it up, because after November their phone is going be very quiet. I would imagine those plush speaking gigs Bill made lots of cash from are going to dry up considerably. I also suspect what she does in the near future is going to have a major impact on her Senatorial seat.

    And of course the there is the coup de grâce. If she doesn’t get her god damn ego in check, she is going put McCain in the White House. And them Steve be prepared for the republican pundits to repeat your non-sense, “Clinton had run a remarkable race”.

  • During the body of her speech at AIPAC today she got the most sustained response when she mentioned that Obama would be a good friend to Israel. Most of the rest, not so much.

    Why is she talking about her foreign policy?

    Far from conceding, she is talking as if she will be the nominee. The crowd didn’t seem to buy into it very well.

  • I think Hillary is seriously disappointing her own supporters – eg: Hillary Rosen, strong Clinton supporter, today writes “I am not a bargaining chip, I am a Democrat”…

    As far as unifying the party, the ball is in HRC’s court – we’ll wait and see.

  • This campaign is not about the people it’s about Hillary Clinton and her selfishness. Obama proved that through everything, he could still prevail. He represents what America is truly about: a melting pot-and can unite people from all groups. It’s funny how Clinton’s supporters are more adamant and defiant than Obama’s. That’s because we believe in real change and are more interested in an honest democrat than our own selfish interests. I don’t think that he can have a joint Obama-Clinton ticket because she will always try to undermine him and act as if it’s a co-presidency. He defied all odds before and he can do it again without her.

  • Why an Obama-Clinton ticket is the best thing for America. Think about it. America is more messed up than ever before thanks to the current non-administering administration. It will essentially take THREE Presidents to fix this mess. So, Obama’s integrity, ‘git ‘er done’ attitude and willingness to do only what he believes is right-no matter the opposition is exactly what we need for our next leader (no more shafting America so your friends can get richer!) In his corner, we NEED Hillary’s determination, contacts, experience and prior knowledge of what worked and didn’t in the healthcare saga and numerous other areas. We NEED Bill’s global good will, vast experience, and insider info. He can travel the world-as he does now, but in a more important capacity, to help us regain the respect of other nations again, and continue his prior work to reduce global warming, clean up the air, water, food, etc. right along w/ Obama and Hillary. We get THREE highly qualified, dedicated Americans to fix this mess and end the war too! THEN, after Obama’s 8 incredibly productive years, we get Hillary (and Bill) another 8 years to continue what they started!!! If you are a Hillary supporter rather than Obama’s then THIS is the ticket you WANT! It’s the ONLY chance Hillary (or any VP) has of actually getting 16 years in the White House! Think about it. 16 years of getting the added value of either two or three President-qualified people in there to sort this out. Obama, Hillary, and Bill are ALL qualified individually for the job (granted Bill can’t run, but he’s had the job), so let’s put them TOGETHER and really make big, huge, amazing, life and world-saving things happen. It’s absolutely our best hope for survival in a world that’s limiting our future by the second. The three of them together can make the difference we need. Obama-Clinton ’08 – Before it’s too late! Dream team indeed!

  • My partner and I have been Obama supporters all along. This morning we really tried to take a step back though and try to understand why Clinton is acting the way she is. My partner asked what is one of the things Democrat activists have been frustrated with in the last few races – the fact that our candidates seem to fold too quickly. Well, both Obama and Clinto have showed they are fighters. I do not like the way Clinton has run her campaign, but she has showed a lot of mettle. She, in a different way from Obama in my opinion, showed Democrats she is a fighter. I just wish she had also showed that she was willing to continue that fight for the party as a whole, and not just herself.

  • The race was over. It was easy to imagine Clinton going out on a high note, reminding everyone of her class and dignity, and taking the initial steps to heal some wounds, rebuild some bridges, and bring like-minded allies back together.

    But if Clinton has proved anything over the last 16 months of campaigning, it’s that she’s a fighter. And last night, the lights may have gone out on her presidential chances, but her drive to keep going anyway remains strong. Indeed, last night, Clinton’s remarks weren’t conciliatory, they were defiant.

    A TRUE SHAME THAT HILLARY HAD AN OPPORTUNITY BY ACKNOWLEGING OBAMA AS THE NOMINEE TO BRING THE PARTY TOGETHER AND SHE CHOSE TO BE HER DEFIANT SELF. I HOPE OBAMA DOES NOT PUT HER ON THE TICKET BECAUSE UNLIKE SOME I THINK HE CAN WIN WITHOUT HER.

  • Let’s be clear on one thing: the voters did not nominate Obama, the superdelegates did. They could have just as easily nominated Clinton. Imagine this scenario: the situation is reversed, and it’s Clinton who has the pledged delegates, and Obama who can claim the popular vote as well as the best map results for winning in November. But the superdelegates choose Clinton. Can you imagine the uproar from his supporters, feeling he had been robbed of the election? There would be loud claims of back-room politics, as well as feelings of loss of their lifelong dream of an African-American in the White House. If you think about this scenario, you can understand how Hillary and her supporters feel, having been robbed of their lifelong dream of a woman in the White House.

  • “”But is it really fair for Clinton to claim that her 18 million supporters nationwide have been made ‘invisible?’ Who’s supposed to be the bad guy here, scary Howard Dean? Clinton is offering more fighting rhetoric. But the fight should be over.””

    Earlier in the speech, Clinton noted that she was supported by people who were ignored by the Bush Administration, left to feel “invisible.” It was a clear reference to the earlier comment.

  • A short mental exercise: Can you think of a single instance ever in which either of the Clintons behaved with graciousness? I know I can’t. Hillary’s performance last night was totally low rent.

  • Deme Cross

    If it wasn’t for all those early SD endorsements Hillary would have been forced out in February.

    The supers made it look WAY closer than it was for a very long time. Until just a few weeks ago HRC had a lead in supers. She started with a MAMMOTH lead in supers.

    Live by the sword, die by the sword.

  • it is time for all democrats to unite behind obama and start getting his message across that we are taking back the government for the people of this country
    this is to important to be letting the biggest sore loser in history be making demands and causing distratctions
    she lost -that does not give her the right to name the vice president.
    the aguement that she has 17 million votes to deliver is silly .
    17 million voters are not going to stay home in nov. and with all democrats pulling together many of those voters are going to join in the cause to say nothing of them getting to know and believe in obama-Sure he will lose some -she would lose some of his millons if it where her running but he does not need her to win.
    lets start this campagin and start winning this race and tell her that she can take her ball and go home and pout if she wants to -shes not as important as she thinks -call her bluff and lets win this race

  • postscript: Imagine the uproar if a viable African-American candidate was continually pushed to drop out of a race in which he was extremely competitve. It just wouldn’t happen. Why was it okay to continually ridicule and pressure a woman who was running an extremely competitive race? If it wasn’t for the superdelegates ganging up for Obama, she would have won. Don’t get me wrong, I like Obama and will vote for him. But I don’t like the way Hillary has been treated.

  • Obama’s ultimate service to America may be that he spared us from 4 more years of her all-about-me-all-the-time drama.

    For her to even ask “what does Hillary want” speaks volumes. I — Me — My. Sorry, but she’s just not that special. Badly in need of a time-out, or a toss into a cold shower, sure. Maybe a personality transplant.

  • HRC became a senator so she could have a shot at the nomination, She spent time as a senator as if she was marking time, voting on issues with her finger to the political winds. She has said she doesn’t want to go back to being a Senator.
    That shows that she used the the State of New York, the Senate and the good of this nation as a stepping stone for her ambition, and if not then it proves that she is a quitter. What she wants is clear, she desperately wants to redecorate the white house. It is clear that she has lost her chance at the nomination. I do not think that Obama and HRC would be a dream ticket unless you mean a nightmare sort of dream. I think Obama is too smart to allow that. That leaves only the McCain ticket. and that is what she will go for, McCain/Clinton in 08.

  • I say give her some time. She has just spent the past 6 to 9 or twelve months on a monumentally exhasting project.
    Give her some time.

  • Erik – your point is well taken. So supers can change their minds? Exactly why Hillary stayed in. With neither candidate acheiving the pledged delegate count, she was still in the race. It’s still the supers who made the decision. And I still hold that Obama would never have been pressured in the way she was, were the situation reversed. But that’s not his doing; I blame the media and yes, his supporters.

  • Deme, my point is that if it wasn’t for the 150 Super lead she started with she never could have run off a string at the end. She would have faded away like Romney and Huckabee did in the GOP.

    The question is whether or not she feels the damage she does teh democratic party by staying in is worth the infinitesimally small chance that 300 supers change their mind and switch to her.

  • I have followed the Democratic primaries from start to finish. I must congratulate the people of America for letting commonsense fuel their decision in their selection of the stronger candidate for the task that awaits in November. However, hindsight (20/20 vision) in the just concluded Democratic primaries should play a major role in his selection of the person for the VP. He would be well advised to stay away from the so-called “Dream Ticket” and select from a fresh pool of prominent people, a person that would be an added asset by equally appealing to the various demographics clearly identified by the Democratic party, to be his running mate. Such a person should be a white female with latino roots. Senator Clinton should be given a prominent position elsewhere in his presidency.

  • I have been watching thislong drawn out primary from Johannesburg South Africa, hoping Obama will win, Mrs Clinton, you have proved that it is not only African leaders like Mr Mugabe who don’t know when to call it quits! If I was an American I would be ashamed of you! As a woman you are an embarassment. Get off the stage, Obama doesn’t need you as his VP – God Save Us!

  • Let’s be clear on one thing: the voters did not nominate Obama, the superdelegates did.

    Actually, to be clear about it, both groups elected Obama. He won the lead in both pledged delegates and superdelegates. The will of the voters was expressed in either a primary, caucus, or mix of the two, depending on the choice of each state. If you want a primary-only, winner-take-all system, feel free to petition for that in advance of the 2012 campaign. But please don’t suggest that voters played no role when you know that to be false.

    Obama didn’t go on a crusade to make states use caucuses or primaries–he was told that delegates are how you get the nomination, so he simply planned to win delegates and did just that. Give him his due and stop rationalizing.

  • If what all of you assert about Hillary is so true, that Hillary supporters will ultimately fall in line, that Obama can win without Hillary, you have to ask yourselves why are they rushing to court her voters? How come Obama had to give a speech where he talked about Hillary? The simple truth is he cannot win without Hillary and her supporters like me. Obama and his groupies have done nothing but change me from being a Democrat to an Independent. He gives a great speech but those speeches have lacked substance and clear plans. The Anti-Hillary sentiment here is not helping at all, in fact it make me less willing to accept Obama now more than ever…perhaps you all will think I am just in a minority that feel this way….the reality is that I am not.

  • > It will essentially take THREE Presidents to fix this mess.

    Wow, talk about the cure being worse than the disease. Can you imagine yourself as President Obama, with all the pressure that entails? Now imagine Hillary running around making speeches, phone calls, press conferences, initiatives, backroom deals, all on her own without clearing anything with you ahead of time. And now imagine Bill doing the same things at the same time. What a mess that would be, huh?

  • The problem is really her feelings of entitlement. She refuses to accept the fact that he has won. It was poor sportsmanship on her part last night. But that’s Hillary for you. She cannot be trusted, she is constantly saying one thing but showing something different. We have a saying in the black community and that is “God don’t like ugly”. And for all of her experience and name power. She has always been about Hillary. If she truly is about uniting the Democratic Party she would have conceded last night.

  • How come Obama had to give a speech where he talked about Hillary?

    Because that’s what people in civil society do when they win. They compliment the loser and the way they played.

  • Deme and other America-for-Clintons Party members–just one thought.

    If Clinton had won 11 straight contests, as Obama did in February/March, do you really believe there’s any chance at all that Obama wouldn’t have been directly herded out of the race?

    But with things as they were, she wasn’t. The media wanted the story to keep going above all else, and the IMO undue deference Democrats showed to the two First Narcissists–as well as Obama’s patient-to-a-fault approach–cost the party four more months before it could focus on victory in November.

    The Clintons are owed NOTHING. If they, for once, put principle over personal ambition, they should be honored. But if they don’t–and they haven’t yet–Obama should keep the maximum possible distance.

  • I as a white senior citizen was elated last night with the Barack Obama winning the nomination.
    It was a moment in history, I was so proud to get to see. However, Senator Clinton was a disappointment with her self serving speech. How should she expect Obama to ever put her on his ticket in November. She is not entitled to anything, unless she is asked first and hopefully that will not happen. Everyone I have spoken with today, was thrilled for Senator Obama, but angered by Hillary Clinton. Maybe the well oiled Clinton Machine has to be put into storage along with its drivers.

  • How should she expect Obama to ever put her on his ticket in November. She is not entitled to anything, unless she is asked first and hopefully that will not happen. Everyone I have spoken with today, was thrilled for Senator Obama, but angered by Hillary Clinton. Maybe the well oiled Clinton Machine has to be put into storage along with its drivers.

  • Obama got the nomination because of the superdelegates that supported him and the superdelegates that turned their backs on their states and Hillary. The Democrats need to get rid of the superdelegates and find a better way of electing a nominee. My vote is going to Mccain.

  • My vote is going to Mccain.

    When women are getting abortions with coat hangers in back allys I hope you’re really proud of that.

  • For more detail on what Nick points out was Obama’s successful delegate-based strategy, see Strategy Was Based On Winning Delegates, Not Battlegrounds from the Washington Post.

    Everyone should read this. Hillary did not get pwned by accident:

    Almost from the beginning, Hillary Rodham Clinton’s superior name recognition and her sway with state party organizations convinced Barack Obama’s brain trust that a junior senator from Illinois was not going to be able to challenge the Clinton political machine head-on.

    The insurgent strategy the group devised instead was to virtually cede the most important battlegrounds of the Democratic nomination fight to Clinton, using precision targeting to minimize her delegate hauls, while going all out to crush her in states where Democratic candidates rarely ventured.

    The result may have lacked the glamour of a sweep, but last night, with the delegates he picked up in Montana and South Dakota and a flood of superdelegate endorsements, Obama sealed one of the biggest upsets in U.S. political history and became the first Democrat since Jimmy Carter to wrest his party’s nomination from the candidate of the party establishment. The surprise was how well his strategy held up — and how little resistance it met.

    “We kept waiting for the Clinton people to send people into the caucus states,” marveled Jon Carson, one of Obama’s top ground-game strategists.

  • I would lke to congratulate Senator Obama on earning the Democratic Nomination. His speech last night was gracious, and inspiring, indeed aggressive when it needed to be. I am one of the 17+ million Clinton suppporters who will be expected to fall behind our party’s nominee. For me, at this point in time, the jury is still out.

    I have heard many fine things about Senator Obama. The selection of his running mate will be his first Presidential level-decision. I am objectively watching how he makes it.

    Senator Obama has half the party and Senator Clinton holds the other half. Obviously, one choice is the Joint Ticket. Another logical choice would be Richardson. Each has pros and cons. I will be watching, and it will be interesting to see how he processes the variables.

    This blog copmmunity is intersting, and I am curious to hear your opinions. If not Senator Clinton, then whom? And why? Also, I’m curious, if he did choose Clinton, would that deter you from voting for him in November?

    Let it rip.

  • Mary will not be responsible for a potential Obama loss in November; she has a right to support her candidate, even if it isn’t yours. Someone brought up selfishness above; what is more selfish than to expect others to drop out for your benefit and at your convenience?
    Her comments about Montana and South Dakota being open and closed primaries respectively are accurate. Many here have attributed Clinton’ wins to Republican crossovers in the pas. Why is that OK for you and not for her to make that assumption? Reality is that Montana will be in the red column in the fall. You can take that to the bank.

    If Obama loses in the fall, it is because he has failed to respect a significant portion of the Democratic base. If he is wise, he will make amends

  • Lyn Canon said:
    “Why an Obama-Clinton ticket is the best thing for America.”

    I say: Why a McCain-Clinton ticket is the best thing for America? It would rid us of the Clintons forever!

    4 years Bush I + 8 years Clinton + 8 years Bush II = 20 years of the screwing of the American worker = No More. Never Again.

  • The Democrats need to get rid of the superdelegates and find a better way of electing a nominee. -Jack

    Okay, fine, then eliminate the supers from the equation and give it to the candidate that got the most elected delegates.

  • Boy you guys like to get riled up!!!!! Republican males are posting on every blog saying they are Hillary supporters and are going to vote for Mccain. You guys are falling for the fake posts. Only a male would believe that a woman could be so shallow or uninformed as to switch parties at this time when actions have made it perfectly clear what the republican party stands for. Give all the hard earned tax money to the rich , the corporations, the arms dealers. Make it impossible to make your house payments so home owners can become renters again so rich landlords can become richer. Make wages decrease buying power decrease, more hours less pay. Send the poor kids who can’t afford an eduction to fight colonial wars. Have larger corporations and chains destroy all mom and pop, family run businesses. Give oil companies carte blanc to destroy Alaska, charge $5+ a gallon and pocket obscene profits, while destroying the environment with impunity. take away all the rights and dignity of American citizens. You know how to tell they are Republican males. Males are the ones who root for local teams and have this blindness that says everything my team does is right and everything the other team does is wrong. Why do you think this does not excite women, they look at the thing objectively. Sure a lot of women will be disappointed if Hillary isn’t the nominee. Sure they will grieve but anyone who thinks they will act like a 12 year old boy is a misogynist.
    I thought hillary made a great speech last night. She should not have conceeded last night. When she does conceed she gets her and Obama more free air time. You don’t think their people already discussed this? She will support him and she will encourage her followers. She is from the old school. You don’t vote or do anything w/o getting something in return. That is how politics was always played.

  • A view from Canada:
    Congrats to your nominee Mr. Obama. It seems to me that Democrats should line up behind your candidate as quickly as possible because Mr. McCain has a huge head start campaigning around the country. The differences in policy and beliefs are HUGE. Anyone of Democratic leanings can see this. Do you want to continue a war in Iraq at incredibly huge costs of resources and lives when it was started on false pretences (even admitted by a White House Press Secretary of Bush)!!!!!!!!!! Your attention to that issue alone should overwhelm your feelings of sorrow that your candidate ( Mrs. Clinton) lost. Please do the right thing and vote with your conscience not accomodating bitter feelings.!!!

  • My vote is going to Mccain.

    So you’re mourning Hilary’s loss by throwing her issues on the pyre as well?

    “If we can’t have Hillary, let’s kill off withdrawal from Iraq and the establishment of universal health care too!”

    Pathetic.

  • The superdelegates spotted her a huge lead…

    She squandered it.

    She raised $250 million…

    She spent it all and is now $40 million in debt.

    She planned for a race that was to be over on February 5th…

    She had no contingency plan in case the race lasted longer.

    She surrounded herself with sycophants and loyal incompetents…

    Why does anyone think she’d be a good President?

    She sounds like George W. Bush

  • […] if he did choose Clinton, would that deter you from voting for him in November? — Everett, @124

    No, but I’d vote with a much heavier heart and prepared for another loss in November. I think Clinton as VP would be as poisonous to Obama’s chances as Lieberman had been to Gore’s. The two are from two different planets, almost, when it comes to personal style and general philosophy of politics, for all the similarities in their platforms.

    It would be like yoking an ox and a donkey together — something the Bible prohibits and rightly so.

  • I wonder if the next “scene” in this never ending story will be Hilliary seeking to be McCains co-pilot.
    GOD forbid.

  • “Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a damn.”

    While I would not expect Barack Obama to use the line on Hillary at this stage in her self-made soap opera and drama, I could not help but think of Scarlett O”Hara as we hear the cry, What will Hillary do?

    The context for those who do not have it memorized is below:

    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Frankly, My Dear,
    I Don’t Give A Damn
    Character Rhett Butler
    Actor Clark Gable
    First Used In Gone with the Wind
    AFI’s 100 Movie Quotes Position #1
    “Frankly, my dear, I don’t give a damn.” is a line from the 1939 film Gone with the Wind starring Clark Gable and Vivien Leigh.

    It was spoken by Gable, as Rhett Butler, in his last words to Scarlett O’Hara. It occurs at the end of the film when Scarlett asks Rhett, “Where shall I go? What shall I do?” if he leaves her. The line is memorable not only because it contains a swear word (which was generally not allowed in films of that time period), but because it demonstrates that Rhett has finally given up on Scarlett and no longer cares what happens to her.

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