John Gibson goes berserk — on air and off

December 22, 2005

Anyone familiar with Fox News broadcasts has come to expect a level of professionalism on par with an elementary school food fight, but once in a while, even the FNC gang manages to surprise.

C&L and Newshounds offered terrific coverage last night of Fox News’ John Gibson completely losing his mind, on the air, while “debating” Rob Boston of Americans United for Separation of Church and State on the so-called “war on Christmas.” You really have to see it to believe it.

A brief description won’t do it justice, but when Rob mentioned that most of the right’s talking points on the issue have been debunked, Gibson started screaming, “Are you calling me a liar?!” I’d say Gibson was furious, but that’s an understatement; it was much closer to pure rage. He ultimately threatened to sue Rob, calling his on-air remarks “actionable.” (Rob should be so lucky.)

But I wanted to take the story a little further. Rob Boston happens to be a close friend and former colleague of mine, and he called me last night to talk about the interview. More importantly, he told me about what happened after the segment.

A couple of hours after Gibson’s show ended and Rob went home, Gibson’s producer called Rob’s cell, saying, “John’s really upset that you called him a liar.” The producer asked if Rob would be willing to appear on Gibson’s radio show for Round Two. Rob, who managed to keep his cool while Gibson became unhinged, said he would.

Before they could schedule an appearance, Gibson got on the phone to start screaming again. Rob, who does not suffer fools kindly, told Gibson the truth — explaining calmly that Gibson is a clown, Fox News is a joke, and their nonsense is demagoguery.

Rob could practically hear Gibson’s head exploding over the phone. Eventually, Gibson said, “Don’t come in where I drink… Don’t come visit a bar when I’m in there.” After Rob asked if Gibson was threatening him, Gibson hung up on him.

The ordeal, as Rob explained, was rather surreal. The bottom line, however, remains the same: Fox News’ John Gibson has pretty serious “issues.” Let’s all hope he gets some help before he ends up hurting someone — or himself.

Update: Rob Boston himself makes a surprise appearance in the comments section.

Ooh, insiders and secrets! I’m getting on other threads and linking to this post.

  • Even the whack-job fundies have to be re-thinking if they want this guy carrying their banner of Jesus. Apparently he not only spews lunacy he is a borderline lunatic. Well in every revolution the true colors of the revolutionaries eventually come out. To nobody’s surprise the far right bible types are completely unhinged and stark raving mad.

    Would Jesus have told non-belivers to be careful where they go drinking? Maybe. I bet he was more of a “check yourself or I’ll turn your wine into water!” kind of guy.

    Is there a school these guys go to that teaches them to start screaming and yelling and threatening when they are challenged? Is it Bob Jones University?

  • CB, I too am interested if round 2 is still on, but, more importantly, I would like to purchase you and Rob a round of drinks, preferably at the bar where Mr. Gibson may be.

  • Rob Boston nailed it. He said that he received an email in August from the Alliance Defense Fund asking for money for the “war on Christmas.” This is SOP for the fundies – pick a topic, scare people half to death, ask them for money to support their “war.” Nothing more than a flim-flam scam.

    And where has Rob Boston been all this time? We need to get him out there more. Maybe he should be hired to teach our side on how to deflect BS from the Fox con artists.

  • The anger of the right, in spite of their hold on power, is one of the most gripping things about what’s been happening in America. The left is frustrated, pissed off, weepy, indignant, flabbergasted, but there’s a logic to that: the left has less political power has probably also been cheated at the ballot box.

    But even after Bush was “re”elected with a “significant margin” and a “real mandate,” the right has continued to blow its top at regular intervals. Why? My theory is that they know they are wrong,but owning up to it would put them in the wrong social group. They don’t like the left (feel outflanked, intellectually and even politically by the left) and will take any ridiculous stance and hold it grimly, murderously, rather than be associated with what they call “elitists” which means “people whose philosophy rules.” Even the arrogance and defensiveness with which the Bush administration tries to increase the power of the executive is due in part to feeling they’ve never been real winners. We lurk in their dreams, making them feel as those they’re losers.

    They’re aggrieved because they see themselves as members of a permanent, ridiculed minority — outsiders — even as we protest that they have all the power in Washington and in the media. But we’re wrong and they’re right: we really do have the power, in the long run. We’re just lazy winners — that’s why we don’t have control of federal government right now.

  • Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Answer the charges.

    I…

    Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop.

    Hahahah. I so picture him off camera with his hands over his ears shouting “la la la la…I can’t hear you!” That is the most immature display I’ve ever seen from someone who claims to be a jounalist.

    I’m with bubba, Rob and CB can have a drink on me!

    Oh, and Happy Holidays!

  • Rob should file a police report for the threat, even if it does not go anywhere. It will at least get a public record of what Gibson said to be picked up by the Mainstream Media in police blotters and show what Gibson really thinks of Christmas – a time to threaten fellow man.

    Jamie
    http://intoxination.blogspot.com

  • In the name of Christ, I can’t believe the dialogue regarding the “War on Christmas” has digressed to red and green anything. We are officially living in the Twilight Zone.

  • GOP hitmen! It all began with Ollie North wanting to meet Abu Nidal in an alley. Too many westerns, too many Suberbowl halftime flyovers. Raging republican hormones.

    I don’t know about you, but the idea of encountering George Will in a bar makes me sleep with my light on. Big bad Bill O’Reilly wielding his loofah! Joe Scarborough fixing one of his Lee van Cleef angel eyes on me. Charles Krauthhammer and his Eretz Israel Uzi, and now John “Thumper” Gibson The stuff of bad dreams and sleepless nights.

  • the right has continued to blow its top at regular intervals. Why? My theory is that they know they are wrong

    I think you give them too much credit – I doubt that they have the self-awareness to know that they are wrong. My theory is that people who don’t like to think too much – and this includes bigots and homophobes – want everybody to be exactly like them – so that way they don’t have to think too much. Anyone or anything that is different might actually cause them to *think* and in that thinking they might actually end up examining themselves.. and that wouldn’t be good, would it?

  • Cheezits, PW –

    You know you’re not supposed to say that in front of the children. Now I gots to gets them some more Ridalin…

  • I’m with Jamie, I think that Rob Boston should get the threat on record. Filing a police report is probably the only way to do it. Plus, that might prompt Gibson to act on his threat to sue for slander, which would be most excellent.

  • If Boston does appear on Gibson’s program, I hope that while continuing to expose this “war on Christmas” nonsense for what it is, that he can also redirect the discussion to the very real and major issues in the news right now: war in Iraq, investigations into the CIA leak and pre-war intelligence, indictments of administration officials and Republican members of congress, the illegal wiretapping authorized by the administration, spying on domestic groups excercising their rights tof free speech and assembly… the list gooes on and on.

    Fox cooks up this lame brain “war” in an attempt to keep their audience from noticing the real stories while they have a few days away from work over the holidays.

  • If I were Rob, I’d be kinda worried at this point. Wasn’t Gibson the one who thought “five in the noggin” sounded like a good idea?

  • My prediction — network coverage of the war on Christmas will come with a map dividing America into “red states” and “green states”. Alaska and Hawai’i will be represented as tinsel.

  • To PW – it is my belief that this “war” is nothing more than the so-called macho males fighting for their survival. They see they are losing power to Blacks, women, gays, and secularists. Why else did they pin all their hopes in George Bush, the born-again white male cowboy who is going to save Dodge City (aka America) from all these “evildoers.”

  • It is interesting that ther is debate over red and green. There was a story on CNN last night about some Fin’s who live up near teh Arctic circle and how they claim Santa Clause etc. They wear pointy shoes and colorful floppy hats BTW and have a lot of reindeer. Their point was that they made up santa and the gift giving aspects of christmas and that it is 100% NOT about Jesus. It grew out of a pagan winter solistace story about a spirit who showed up and decided who was good and bad that year.

    So the present giving (economic), tree decorating, behavior judging, santa christmas (little c) is one thing. Then there is the birth of Jesus stuff. There is no reason that OReilly or Gibson or whomever should be advocvating for the non-jesus christmas (trees, presents, green & red).

    I am starting to think there is a war on christmas and it is OReilly and Gibson trying to co-opt a perfectly good secular pagan holiday and make it about jesus. The christmas celebrated by many in this country is not at all religious.

    The story also mentioned places like Japan where many celebrate christmas despite few being christian. They think it is fun to decorate the tree, give gifts and slug down brandy egg-nog. I like their take on it. Pass the nog and don’t spare the brandy!

  • ” … I would like to purchase you and Rob a round of drinks, preferably at the bar where Mr. Gibson may be.”

    Let me know!

  • PW, you got it, man, you hit the nail on the head. Your post just summed up my feelings over this matter and my wonder at this continual anger from the right despite them being in power, and their brazen tactics since then. You are right, you are right, and you are right.

  • As to the question of why these wingnuts are so short of fuse, and so full of self-pity and victimhood, the words of Abraham Lincoln in his Cooper Union speech are as apt today as they were when he spoke them just before the Civil War, addressing basically the same strange attitude among the proponents of slavery, who had won every legal battle to that point and still accused the Republicans (they were the good guys then) of oppressing them. It’s amazingly timely:

    ” …what will convince them? This, and this only: cease to call slavery wrong, and join them in calling it right. And this must be done thoroughly – done in acts as well as in words. Silence will not be tolerated – we must place ourselves avowedly with them. Senator Douglas’ new sedition law must be enacted and enforced, suppressing all declarations that slavery is wrong, whether made in politics, in presses, in pulpits, or in private. We must arrest and return their fugitive slaves with greedy pleasure. We must pull down our Free State constitutions. The whole atmosphere must be disinfected from all taint of opposition to slavery, before they will cease to believe that all their troubles proceed from us.
    I am quite aware they do not state their case precisely in this way. Most of them would probably say to us, “Let us alone, do nothing to us, and say what you please about slavery.” But we do let them alone – have never disturbed them – so that, after all, it is what we say, which dissatisfies them. They will continue to accuse us of doing, until we cease saying.”

  • Ha, if you go to Gibson’s column on the Faux News website,

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,179442,00.html

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  • I also think Gibson’s a clown; Fox News is a joke, and they’re all demagogues. Where’s the bar at? I’ll gladly go there and meet the Gibster.

  • You guys are the best bunch of progressive blog readers/activists a guy ever had! Thanks for your support and kind words. Some people are suggesting that my response to John might spell the end of my appearances on FNC. To that I can only say, “Don’t do me any favors.” Fox needs me more than I need Fox.

    I entered the world of activism 18 years ago in the hopes of making a difference and sparking an intelligent discussion of complex church-state issues–not taking part in a freak show. When I left the Fox studios last night, all I could think was, “I need a long shower.”

    And now a plug for my own books. I’ve written three. Put “Robert Boston” into Amazon to check them out. You might especially like “Close Encounters with the Religious Right,” which chronicles my travels in the bizarro world of right-wing fundamentalist Christianity.

    Thanks again for all of your good thoughts! You guys rock, and so does the Carpetbagger. That’s why I read him every day. (This has been a non-compensated endorsement.)

  • The question:”why are wingnuts so angry” is backwards, the question should be phrased “what attracts angry people to reactionary political positions”? Throughout history angry frustrated men (and usually predominantly men) gravitate to reactionary paranoid politics. It doesn’t have to be “right-wing” per se, in the ex-Soviet Union it was precisely these sort of people who were the strongest supporters of the Communist Party – because they could trust it to “beat” their enemies and anyone who threatened them by being different. Angry people need to find external enemies because no-one wants to blame themselves for their own unhappiness.

  • Gibson will be easy to spot in the bar…he’ll be wearing the little leather Harley cap and the very butch chaps…

  • I actually saw this segment, pretty much by accident.

    A more distrubing performance you are not likely to see.

    Mr. Gibson is really losing it. Did he really mean to say that a school board forbid students to bring green and red ‘things’ into school but that did not mean green and red clothes?

  • Merry Christmas!

    It is noteworthy that Chanukah commemerates victory in history’s first war fought for freedom of (from?) religion.

  • A news organization that is “fair and balanced” doesn’t have to advertise that is is “fair and balanced”. It’s kind of like protestinging too much…

  • What a fantastic segment; Boston did a great job. I do have one question though.

    Boston says this: “I’m going to explain to John why he’s a liar. You told the whole country that kids in Plano TX and Saginaw MI couldn’t wear red and green clothing. That’s a lie; they can wear it.” Gibson says he never said it.

    I know O’Reilly said all of this crap about red and green clothes, but has Gibson? I did a little looking on the internets and couldn’t find anything. Not to say that there’s really a difference between O’Reilly, Gibson, or any of the puppets on Fox, but it would be nice to have our facts stright. Sounds like something MMFA would be able to check into.

  • Rob Boston displayed excellent technique for going on Fox, especially when you are the advocate for something you know the host is against. Have something ready to say when you go on and get it out quickly. Otherwise the Fox “newsperson” will try to get you off balance with a “do you still beat your wife” type question or other such non sequitur. Stay cool – let the Fox person flip out. It amazes me how these TV people don’t realize everything they do and say is being recorded – let them put their own noose on.

  • Rob Boston was brilliant in his smackdown of gibbering John Gibson. The only thing that could have improved his victory would have been to pull out his wallet and offer Gibson all the money in it to sue him, saying something like,

    “Please John, please sue me. We all know what happened the last time Fox sued a liberal, when Al Franken laughed all the way to the bank.”

    Sadly, it’s one of those things that you think of only after a juicy encounter like that. Even so, Rob blasted Gibson’s bullshit right out of the water. May it happen over and over again with every liberal that goes on Fox. Time to start calling them what they are: liars and propagandists.

    And Gibson’s telephone tirade was classic bully psychology. I’d love to know what bars that tired old bastard drinks at…

  • Don’t file a lawsuit and don’t go back on Fox. It should be practice not to participate in imaginary debates.

    I’m an American who hasn’t been in the U.S. in almost two years now, had been feeling pretty homesick this time of year, but christ that was the most assinine thing I’ve ever seen. If that’s what Christmas has become in America, keep it. The people who are pissed spend 10 hours a week in church anyway, do they really want to have it everywhere they go?

    24 hour news is the problem. Turns out there’s barely 6 a day that means anything so they’ve adopted some sort of ‘sports’ version of the news. Root for your team, insult the other. Gotta have a team otherwise you’re a loser. Man that guy is a whiney fuck.

  • Personally I think that Gibson and O’nutso have ruined Christmas. Ask any kid what christmas is and they will tell you it’s about Santa and presents. Christmas was, is and always will be pagan. On the other hand Holiday translates to Holy Day or Days. How with Jesus in mind could that be offensive to anyone? I think that these nuts are crazier than anyone can imagine. Happy Holidays would mean tolerance for every religion and that’s not what they are about.

  • I found this review of one of John Gibson’s books on Amazon.

    38 of 52 people found the following review helpful:

    John Gibson: Journalist, or flip-flopping phoney?, April 11, 2005
    Reviewer: – See all my reviews
    John Gibson originally started as a broadcaster in Sacramento. At the time, he anchored a weekly show called “The West,” which highlighted environmental and other liberal issues impacting the western half of the United States. At the time, it was in vogue to report on these “lefty” kinds of stories. By the late nineties, however, Gibson had put his finger to the wind, decided that “liberal” reporting was now out, and adopted a newfound conservative broadcast persona.

    Gibson is worse than a partisan hack–he’s a phoney. A superficial careerist who is willing to change his image to suit whatever political tide is fashionable. In ten years, when the pendelum has swung back leftside, watch for John Gibson’s amazing transformation and re-re-invention.

    What he is not is a good journalist or commentator, as demonstrated in his shoddy “research” for this book. Gibson cherrypicks isolated stories to support his pre-decided conclusion, while ignoring the numerous–in fact, countless–examples of other countries admiring and respecting the United States. During the Clinton years, there was not another country more respected around the world than America. It is not America these other counties dislike, it is Bush and his catastrophic decision-making. And yes, I draw a VERY sharp distinction between America and Bush. If you’re unhappy that other countries now dislike us, you probably have your own sad voting record to blame. Bush has brought this on himself through his own bad decisions. As William Bennett and Dr. Laura like to remind us, there are consequences for our bad decisions.

    But why am I even bothering? This book never even made a blip in Amazon’s sales ratings, let alone the bestseller lists. I guess Gibson’s latest attempt to cash in on a bandwagon has not done so well. Better luck next time.

  • Wow! If that’s the one true A. Whitney Brown, along with Mr. Boston, then this truly is a very amazing comments thread. All that’s needed now is for Kurt Vonnegut to type something in, and then Gibby himself sit down and put those threats in writing in a comment here! That would truly be a FitzMas miracle…

    I’m just a bit surprised that everyone else was surprised. Isn’t this the sort of thing that they have supposedly been doing, out of the viewing public’s sight, ever since Putsch stole the White House the first time?

  • CKT makes a good point. We must have our facts straight, because however much those right-wing pundits bluster and outright lie if we get caught in a falsehood they will call us on it and scream about it at the top of their lungs, providing themselves with cover from facing up to their own lies.

    And to be factually correct, to call it a lie one has to be certain the liar KNOWS he is lying. So when Gibson denies saying something he indeed did say, you can surely call him a liar. But when he repeats something about some school in Podunk, WI (Wisconsin seems to be a favorite state for them to pick on,) he could be repeating someone else’s lie or even misunderstanding. Now when he does this stuff repeatedly, as with this “war” on Christmas deal, one is inclined to think him a liar when the possibility still exists that he could merely be incredibly stupid, and his penchant for threats sort of indicates that.

    BTW I’m glad to know that you’re reading this Rob, and I want to say thank you for doing what I would think has got to be one of the hardest things in the world – going on one of those shows and attempting to stand up to one of those assholes on his own turf and under his own terms.

  • I don’t mean to sound like a one note instrument, but I think we should be certain that what Boston said is 100% accurate before we pile on Gibson. If it turns out that Boston was mistaken, there’s an obvious mea culpa:

    “I (Boston) mistakenly accused Gibson of lying about Plano, TX banning red and green clothes. I could not concentrate when Gibson was screaming at me, and I accidentally confused him with his fellow Fox News anchor Bill O’Reilly, who has lied about the red and green clothes accusation on multiple occasions. My apologies to Gibson. However, Gibson has lied on a number of other occasions with regards to the so-called “War on Christmas”. For instance…. [long list here]”

    There might be other ways of dealing with the situation if it turns out Gibson never spread the red and green clothes lie.

    But if Gibson did lie about red and green clothes, then add it to the list and no apologies are necessary.

    Remember, facts are what separate us from the wingnuts…

  • Re #s 22, 37 – I’ve been using “foul and biased.”

    I wish I’d caught this segment, but I’ve long
    found I can’t stomach Fox or right wing hate
    radio anymore. Pity. From all accounts, it
    seems Rob Boston really did a number
    on Gibson.

  • Saw the clip on Crooks and Liars and was impressed with Mr. Boston’s appearance. Well Done!

    The sad fact is that all too soon the Christmas season will be done and this will all likely be forgotten…until next year.

    How about we all be proactive and start a pre-emptive war on the “War-on-Christmas” crowd next October (or whenever the holiday retailing season begins)? And we should save all of these wonderful clips and play them back to the offenders.

    That is, provided they will stop yelling at everyone long enough to see them.

  • Given the chickenhawk mentality of Gibson, O’Reilly, Cheney, and Bush, Gibson’s “threat” was probably more of a plea not to hurt him or force him to face the real world. They are the most cowardly bunch of wimps I’ve seen.

    Doug

  • I know it’s been a common right-wing pundit tack to attack the trial lawyers and all sorts of “lawsuit-happy-ism”. But I don’t know if Gibson actually staked this position out but threatening to sue on a whim, wouldn’t that make him a bit hypocritical? Does anyone know, has he railed against such “lawsuit-happy-ism”?

  • Sounds like he’s switching gears as the “war on christmas” draws to an end Gibson wants to start a war on Canada…the man needs enemies like a vampire needs blood and that ‘s my word

  • Oh please somebody tell me where he drinks and when.
    Just 3 minutes is all I ask and then 3 more with O’really!
    Christmas comes early for those who ask!

    Ty Davis

  • CKT, here’s some corroborating evidence for you.

    “Among the incidents debunked by Americans United is a tale frequently told by Fox News Channel commentator John Gibson. In Gibson’s new book, The War on Christmas: How the Liberal Plot to Ban the Sacred Christian Holiday Is Worse Than You Thought, he asserts that the public schools in Plano, Texas, have banned students from wearing green and red clothes. The story has been reported uncritically in other media outlets and hyped by Bill O’Reilly but it is apparently untrue.”

    http://www.au.org/site/News2?JServSessionIdr005=spshdboj72.app1b&abbr=pr&page=NewsArticle&id=7719&security=1002&news_iv_ctrl=1241

    Hopefully that link works for you.

  • Ty, make sure he gets a few drinks in before he picks a fight with you. It will be way more comical when he’s drunk.

    I don’t know what Gibson is on to even think that drunken fights are anything but pathetic.

  • Rian-

    That helps a lot. I’m sure AU has it right. Next time I’m at the bookstore, I’m going to look in Gibson’s book for the passage, only to edify my on curiosity. Thanks for the link.

  • vanya’s comment above is well stated and

    very important to understand.

    fox news is rupert murdoch’s effort to make money off of these angry folks.

    had this been the 1920’s or 30’s, fox news would have been at the other end of the political spectrum exploiting angry people there for profit.

    with respect to gibson and others, it may take a nut to get other nuts to watch and thereby boost ratings and ad revenue.

    the dangerous part for this country is that fox newspersons function as lynch mob leaders in their efforts to generate controversy among this foolish, angry group and thereby maintain listenership.

    .

  • CKT and Rian,

    As much as it pains me to say it (and in apparent contradiction of the Americans United for Church and State site linked above), John Gibson may in fact have the facts straight when he claims not to have said the Plano school board banned red and green clothing. In this Dec. 14 “My Word” segment he says:

    The district sent a note home with the students to the parents. I have that note. It says white only for the plates and napkins and stuff because this is a holiday party. They were making it clear it was not a Christmas party. The ban on red and green extended to the icing on the cupcakes.

    Now the school district is taking advantage of the fact someone said red and green clothing was banned to claim this whole story is bogus. It is not. Once again, I possess the document from the district to parents. The silliness and pettiness of Plano’s anti-Christmas campaign cannot be covered up.

    I think that explains in part why he pounced so hard on Boston. He knew he could catch him out on a technicality, thus obscuring Boston’s larger (and correct) point. After all, who cares whether secularists are plotting to destroy Christmas if you can inflate a minor skirmish into a 99% bogus war?

    Boston may have been a little careless in leaving Gibson this loophole. It might have been prudent to mention that there are a handful of instances (in the nation’s tens of thousands of schools) in which school administrators have overvigorously interpreted the separation of church and state.

    Still doesn’t make for a war though.

    (Of course, the “My Word” quote could just be hot air. Without a copy of the book to refer to, there’s really no telling.)

  • Jamie from a few answers ago had the right idea – report this not-so-veiled threat to the NYPD. It then gets in the public record and if the NY Daily News, which loves to tweak Murdoch (their rival in the daily NY tab wars with his NY Post) should somehow (cough cough) get wind of it, they will run with it. We really have to start fighting back against these rightwing asswipes.

  • I think that explains in part why he pounced so hard on Boston. He knew he could catch him out on a technicality, thus obscuring Boston’s larger (and correct) point.

    This is part of what makes the whole incident so amusing. Gibson was technically correct in the details but unable to bring it across in a soundbite. I wonder how many times his guests have been in that position?

  • This is pretty funny.
    FOX is predictably coming loose at the seems.
    Can you imagine Gwen Ifill or Lehrer having
    on a guest and then going all loony on camera
    afterward and challenging them to a Zell Miller duel in a bar?

    When did Republicans go all crazy? I don’t get it.

  • i used to routinely say ‘merry christmas’ during this time o’ the year. now when i do i cringe in embarrassment, knowing i’m doing what o’reilly and gibby want me to do. so i’ve switched to happy holidays or the like.

    so their ‘war’ has had the reverse effect on me, anyway.

  • The thing is, I think Gibson is probably right on this one. It was O’Reilly that said red and green clothes werent allowed, not Gibson (in his book).

    And it turns out, from what I understand, that the school did do something bizarre by not allowing students to bring green and red paper plates and other paper stuff or whatever.

    So I hope Rob Boston is ready to deal with this fact, or its going to make Gibson look right, and thats something he isn’t on anything else.

  • Setting aside whether John Gibson did or didn’t say there was a ban on red or green clothing, Rob Boston was completely correct in saying the War on Christmas was a complete sham based on lies and half-truths. I think we can all agree that O’Reilly, Gibson, FOX News and the rest of the right-wingers are completely full of shit on this.

    I think Boston’s right about Plano and Gibson. But if not, who’s going to remember the “War on Christmas” in a couple of days anyway?

  • first off…A “+” Whitney Brown.

    As I was leaving Costco today I said to the nice check-out person I hope I won’t offend you by wishing you a “happy holiday”. He smiled and said not at all. He mentioned a rumor who’s origin could not be pinned down that Costco employees could not say MC to shoppers. The rumors were so wide spread that a memo went out across the country from corporate
    stating plainly that each individual could say whatever greeting they cared to. we decided that since it was so close to the holiday we threw in a mutual Merry Christmas.

    by the time I got to my car it hit me that the super creeps had stepped in between myself and the everyday folks we come in contact with and created an atmosphere of un- ease and wariness in what should otherwise be a light hearted exchange. A season of…joy (im mostly crabby but at some point it kicks in) they stepped into our most private little trite exchanges that add up to a nice day.
    must keep the sheep on edge at all times
    please forgive my inability to use all the keys when i type…
    howdy christmas!

  • Interesting slant, MN progressive. Seems a number of origins are claimed for the major Xmas myths, few of them Xian. The Roman Saturnalia had lights, feasting and gift giving. Some say the outlawed Xians celebrated the birth then so they wouldn’t be noticed in all the merriment. Germans first put lights on fur trees to pray for the return of the sun. The evergreen tree symbolized the continuation of life in a seemingly lifeless time.

    The point is, every pre-Christian culture had a winter solstice festival, which morphed into Christmas, and a spring equinox or planting festival, which became Easter. (Eggs are a universal symbol of new life.) Along came the Xians and they simply appropriated what was already there. I think the Wiccans should go on Fox to accuse the Xians of thievery.

    It is very cool to think of the continuity of our major festivals. Few things last for so long. Xianity will someday have come and gone, but those spring and winter celebrations will still be with us.

  • These people are all certifiable. What the hell is a “war” on Christmas? They will stoop to any level to sell books and keep the simpleton’s in the American public ranting about something. Gibson is a liar and I think I’ll send him an email saying just that. And I’ll show up in any bar he names to “discuss” it with him.

  • Boston kicks ass! Great job, dude!

    And I wish I were you so I could go into the bar where Gibson drowns his sorrows and dare him to throw the first punch.

    Would I be so lucky . . . that fat-ass, dough-faced, chickenhawk, poor excuse for a man lying on the floor with blood coming out of his nose . . . it gives me tingles.

  • A quick note about the Plano school’s decision to disallow green and red plates and frosting: from having talked to a parent (who happens to be Christian) in that school district, my understanding is that it had more to do with janatorial issues (i.e., stains, etc.) than with any dismissal of Christmas.

  • For what it’s worth, I was at the bookstore this evening and picked up a copy of Gibson’s book. I looked for an index, and of the piece of sh*t doesn’t even have an index, so I knew wasn’t going to be able to find the reference to Plano quickly. I flipped through, read a few passages, checked back some vomit and set it back down before severe atrophy of my brain could set in. Thus I couldn’t confirm that Gibson’s book discusses red and green clothes.

    prm is exactly right, this “war” will be as worthless as a dried out christmas tree on the side of the road in just a couple of days.

    One more point: If anyone appears on Fox and makes a glorious stink like Boston, please, please, PLEASE tape-record all your conversations with Fox personal following your appearence. Such a recording would be a joy to listen to.

  • I appreciate the larger point made by some here: by creating this phony War on Christmas, the Gibsons and the O’Reillys have made people uncomfortable with simply saying “Merry Christmas” in casual everyday contacts. As a Church-going Christian, I hope Hell has a special place in it for unscrupulous hacks who will prostitute Christ for their mean vicious little agenda.

    BTW have you heard the mega-churches in the South close on Christmas Day? None of those good Bush-voting Christians come to church on Christmas Day, too busy opening their presents. But not to worry, they can always buy a DVD of Christmas services.

    Excuse me, I gotta go puke.

  • A small footnote: John Gibson and Barry Lynn (who works with Rob Boston) have been having this exchange of letters on http://www.beliefnet.com for the past few weeks about the “war” on Christmas. In Gibson’s final letter just posted he decides to ignore all the substantive arguments and call Rob a “goon”; Lynn then rebuts Gibson, concluding that Gibson may still get presents from Santa because the “man in the red suit” watches CNN.

  • War on Christmas indeed…

    A few weeks ago I came home to find an automated message on my AM. It was from some organization opposing gay marrage. The spokesperson said she was the mother of three.

    What was fascinating was the question ” do you feel like you are being attacked?” if you do press 1 ”

    This question and prompt was performed TWICE back to back.

    It struck me that this group was mining for the angriest most paranoid respondents it can find. Folks like John Gibson.

  • What’s with the right wing “war” thing. War on Christmas, War or Terrorism..Culture wars.. Administration Political speeches now routinely made before assembled troops and battle flags..Secret police that torture and spy with impunity…. What will be next. Torchlight parades and party uniforms and deportation of undesirables?
    Sounds like a war on democracy.

    It gives me the willies….

  • I have a bit of Gibson gossip. He used to live in my town (Stillwater, NJ). He bought a house here that had an illegal bathroom. Before he closed on the sale, the building inspector made the seller remove the fixtures. When Gibson moved in, he promptly put in new fixtures without a permit and got caught. Mind you, this is area is 2/3 Republican. Made front page news here.

    I don’t know where he drinks, I’ll report back here if I see him.

  • You lefties have it all wrong—here is my story from the heartlandand my thanks to foxnews for restoring my faith in Christmas. It was adressed to Mr. O’Reilly this date as follows:

    Billy,
    Thank you, thank you, and thank you for saving Christmas. We were at Wal-Mart last week when a “greeter” actually said “Merry Christmas”…well it just made our season. We took the 77 dollars we had managed to save up for Christmas gifts and bought both our daughters a red and green outfit. We also had enough left over to purchase some red and green paper plates. All the colors of Christmas cheered up the family to high heaven although, we became a little confused because isn’t the Mexican flag also red and green? Anyway, maybe next year you could bully the Mexicans into changing their flag colors.
    My wife was wondering if you could e-mail us a publicity head shot of yourself because we would like to incorporate your likeness next year in our backyard aluminum sculpture nativity scene, probably as one of the wise men. You should see what she can do with discarded aluminum foil, it’s amazing. It’s something you might like to feature on your show next year if you’re still on. Also, we have devoutly been praying that God would cut you a little slack on your sexual deviancy thing since you’ve done such wonderful, godly work this season in saving Christmas. Anyway take care, stay on the wagon and off the telephone. (Someone besides your victim might be taping you this year) God bless and Merry Christmas!!!
    The Woods Family
    Colorado

  • Ugh. I read through this entire thread and still don’t know whether Rob Boston’s allegations have merit or not. It was delicious to see Gibson go berserk, but not very ethical if Boston was just shooting off his mouth.

  • You crazy lefties. You really think society takes you seriously? You’re entertainment! Boston is a loon as is the proprietor of this blog. And the readers? You guys crack me up. Don’t ever change!

  • My thoughts exaxtly Matt, 85 comments not one link to the incident hmmm yet there are links to just about anything else but coincedink I think not. So keep up the good work I never met a good smear I did like anyways.

  • Interview of John Gibson by Pat Robertson on the Christian Broadcasting Network:

    ROBERTSON: Barry is. Barry says that if a church is burning down, the local community could not send a fire engine to put the fire out, because that would violate, quote, ‘separation of church’—he is fanatical.

    GIBSON: Well, no, he is. And if you say to Barry, ‘When did a Christmas tree become a religious symbol?’ I mean, most Christians don’t look at a Christmas tree and say, ‘That’s a symbol of my religion.’ But he says if there’s any celebration of Christmas in school—and he includes a tree or Santa Claus, or even the colors red and green, then it has to be forbidden. I mean, look, this is how in Plano, Texas, the school district got around the banning red and green in the school.

    ROBERTSON: Red and green?

    GIBSON: Yes. They said that . . . .

  • Gibson never said red and green “clothes” – he said paper plates, napkins and icing on cupcakes. I believe him, because the same thing happened at my kids’ school. The principal removed the few real Christmas ornaments from the school “holiday store” because one parent complained about them. Teachers were forced to take home poinsettias their kids had given them because they were to “Christmassy”. This is really happening, and you bunch of clowns are high-5’ing because Gibson rightfully defended himself after being called a liar! What a bunch of losers!! I hope this group is in charge of selecting the next democrat presidential candidate – they will have no chance of winning! Keep living in your own little fantasy world where the truth has no value, and is to be avoided.
    Merry Christmas!

  • Brent,

    Pretty lame defense you have there IMO. Christmas is basically a pain in the ass nowadays that the corporatists have completely taken it over. Why waste public school time on Christmas anyway? You want to celebrate a religion that believes in talking snakes (Christianity), go ahead, I really could care less, just do not feel that you can force me to do the same.

    Of course the ‘war on Christmas’ is bogus as most of us who live a place called reality can easily see. 2162 U.S. soldiers dead to date in a real war situation caused by the liar George Bush Jr. THAT is what all news s/b talking about.

  • Did we ever figure out where Gibson Drinks? Does O’really? Drink? That would be fun to visit a bar that they were in and just go up to their table and start calling them out on all their lying.

  • Many conservative, right-wing Bapstist churches are closed today, December 25th. My liberal Episcopalian church is holding services. Which would you consider to be more Christmasy (and more Christian for that matter – actually open on the second holiest holiday of the year)?

    In order to not offend those celebrating other holidays in other faiths (Channukah, Kwanza, Festivus), we wish “Happy Holidays”. This does not negate Christmas, but rather takes into account the feelings of our neighbors. Jesus you may recall was big on treating others nicely.

    37Jesus said unto him, “`Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.’38 This is the first and great commandment.39 And the second is like unto it: `Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.” (Matthew 22:37-40 KJV)

    or if you prefer, the more contemporized version in The Message

    37 Jesus said, “”Love the Lord your God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence.’ 38 This is the most important, the first on any list. 39 But there is a second to set alongside it: “Love others as well as you love yourself.’ 40 These two commands are pegs; everything in God’s Law and the Prophets hangs from them.”

    It’s both funny and sad how the religious right seems to forget this key section of the Bible.

    Merry Christmas, John Gibson. May the love of Christ fill you with peace and may you spread this love to others, regardless of their religious or political affiliations. That, John, is the true meaning of Christmas.

    And to those of you reading this whose religious proclivities I won’t pretend to know: Happy Holidays

  • Hey, dudes, the US Post Office only sells Kwanzza, Hanukkah, and Eid Stamps. All that the crazy christers get are Holiday Cookie Stamps.

    Keep up the great work in separating Church and State and all that jazz!

    Next you can celebrate with the powers that be as they change Christmas to Yuletide like they did in Germany 1938. Dudes, start up your burners….get ready to fry a few you know evil freakers

  • Comment 92 is a lie. The USPS does sell Christmas stamps
    with Christian themes, not just “holiday cookies”.
    There is an example right here.

    Her comments about Nazis deserve no response but contempt.

  • The war is on the other religions. The solution to the problem can be found in the J.R. “Bob” Dobbs theological philosophy. If we Americans truly respect all religious traditions, then we should have a paid holiday for the founder of each tradition. L. Ron. Hubbardmas, Rev. Moonmas, Joseph Smithmas, etc. Before long everybody’s religion (or at least the 365 most popular) would have a celebratory holiday and the rest of us would get the year off with pay. On leap years we could have our paeon to the American work ethic and show up to work on February 29th.

  • Right Wing Christians aren’t Christians at all. They cherry-pick the most outlandish elements of the Old Testament, the fire, the brimstone, the executing, etc., and wrap this stuff very loosely around Jesus. Hell!, Jews don’t have the New Testament and they don’t seem to have this vindictive, anti-tolerant attitude toward their fellow man, (except for maybe the right-wing Neo-Con Jews). I see little difference between the right-wing “Christians” and the Taliban, who wrap their Middle Ages crap around Islam. Lest we forget, Christmas means “Christ Mass”. Does this require all Christians go to a Catholic or Anglican Church on Dec. 25th. Holiday meant “Holy Day” in the Middle Ages.
    Hmmm…, what’s their beef?

  • There were many churches closed on Sunday as Right Wing Cristian states. What’s up with that? And, Susan, you could have gotten the Madonna stamps, as you can every year. They may have not been immediately available at your local Post Office because they had so many left over from last year (popular?) that they didn’t want to print more due to the impending increase in price. You could have ordered them.

  • I think its a shame that we can’t have a civil discussion between people of opposing viewpoints anymore. While I believe that its perfectly acceptable to celebrate Christmas, or Hanukka or Kwanzaa, or any other holiday, in the public sector (ie: schools, stores etc.), I don’t take offense if somebody says “Happy Holidays” to me, nor do I have an issue if somebody does not wish to celebrate these occasions. Happily, we live in a free country, where we all have the right to express ourselves as we choose, within the bounds of the law. I don’t like it when somebody burns a flag, but I do believe in their right to do so. As a child, in the early 70’s, I grew up singing Christmas carols along with Hanukka songs in school, and I don’t think it turned me into an religious zealot. While we all knew that Christians observed Chistmas as the birth of Christ, it was not dwelled, upon in school, rather, it was one part of the overall celebration. I think that the extremists from both sides, right and left, should consider that they hurt their causes when the raise the level of anger in these discussions. John Gibson is wrong, not because of his belief, which he is entitled to and which many people, myself included, share to one extent or another, but because he resorted to ranting and raving when someone disagreed with him. This reduces cable news to the same level as right wing talk radio (or left wing talk radio), which is little more than scripted entertainment.

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