MoveOn’s ‘sweetheart’ deal

Anytime a post begins, “Conservative blogs are all excited about…” you know you might as well reach for the Maalox.

On Monday, as everyone now knows, MoveOn.org took out a full-page ad in the NYT with a provocative headline: “General Petraeus or General Betray Us?” According to one report, the group paid about $65,000 to run the advertisement.

Yesterday, the right decided that the ad rate was too low, and that the New York Times intentionally lowered its rate because the newspaper hates America. Or something. Figuring the right out is tricky sometimes.

John Cole had a great item in which he documented the spread of the charge: one conservative asserted that the NYT gave MoveOn a sweetheart deal on the ad, another linked to the first, and then a third linked to both as proof that the story must be true. Apparently, if three far-right blogs make the same charge in the same day, it should be considered fact.

Today, the rarely-reliable, conservative New York Post got in on the fun, insisting that the NYT gave MoveOn a $116,000 discount.

The New York Times dramatically slashed its normal rates for a full-page advertisement for MoveOn.org’s ad questioning the integrity of Gen. David Petraeus, the commander of U.S. forces in Iraq. […]

Citing the shared liberal bent of the group and the Times, one Republican aide on Capitol Hill speculated that it was the “family discount.”

“I’m surprised they had to pay anything at all for the ad,” the GOP staffer said. “They could have just asked the editorial page to run it and it wouldn’t have cost them a cent.”

Ah, conservative wit. Is there anything more humorous?

Naturally, the right has embraced the New York Post article with great enthusiasm. There are, however, a couple of problems with the charge.

For example, there’s still no proof that Times cut MoveOn a sweetheart deal. Jake Tapper called the NYT (gasp!) to see what’s what.

New York Times spokeswoman Catherine Mathis tells me that it’s Times policy to not “disclose the rate that any one advertiser pays for an ad. The rate that is charged for an ad will depend on a variety of factors including how frequently the advertiser advertises with us, the day of the week, is it color, is it black and white, what section it appears, all of those kinds of things.”

Mathis says the newspaper tries “to keep our advertising columns as open as possible” and “there are many instances when we’ve published opinion advertisements that run counter to the stance that we take on our own editorial pages.” As an example of how the Times is open to all points of view in advertisers, Mathis points out that on September 11, 2007, “we published a full-page advertisement from Freedom’sWatch.org, an organization whose view is opposite of MoveOn.org.”

Freedom’s Watch spokesman Matt David, however tells me the group was charged “significantly more” than MoveOn.org for its ad. The organization says it plans to run a response to the MoveOn.org NYT ad in the Times, “and we plan to demand the same ad rate they paid,” David says.

What’s “significantly more”? Freedom’s Watch apparently didn’t want to say. Perhaps it’s because it’s less than the standard rate, and it would look like the NYT offered the conservatives a sweetheart deal?

John Cole summarized the situation nicely today.

There still is ZERO reporting and ZERO evidence that the NY Times did anything out of the ordinary, but the treason of the NY Times is now established “fact” on the right. And no one, and I repeat, NO ONE, will challenge them. And this is how it goes, day in, day out, as they fling things against the wall and hope they stick to their pre-existing opinions, and reify them for their own political purposes.

And so it goes.

Update: And now Rudy Giuliani wants to exploit join his uninformed conservative brothers in fighting against injustice.

At a campaign appearance today, he called on the Times to run an ad from him, at the same discounted rate, an ad praising Petraeus.

“We’re going to call upon the New York Times to give us the same rate, heavily discounted rate that they gave MoveOn.org for that abominable ad that was very very coincidentally published on the day that Gen Petraeus testified,” Rudy said.

C’mon, Rudy. We expect nonsense from the right-wing blogs, but you’re running for president. Show a little class.

You know what else is established, unquestionable fact, without any evidence or basis? The unimpeachable character of General Petraeus.

If General Petraeus can’t face MoveOn, how can he stand up to the insurgency?

  • C’mon, Rudy. We expect nonsense from the right-wing blogs, but you’re running for president. Show a little class.


    C’mon, CB. You’ve been watching the debates (so we don’t have to). The only way for a repub to pull away from the pack is to be the most certifiably insane person in the pack. They’re all pretty much nuts, so the competition is fierce.

  • “C’mon, Rudy. We expect nonsense from the right-wing blogs, but you’re running for president. Show a little class.”

    Um Steve, I don’t mean to rain on your parade, but you were joking right? I mean come on, if Rudy were to show some class he’d likely have an aneurism.

  • An ad running on the anniversary of 9/11 in the New York Times would also be expected to draw more reader’s eyes since the paper that day would be expected to sell more newsstand copies, and therefore be worth asking more for.

  • “One conservative asserted that the NYT gave MoveOn a sweetheart deal on the ad, another linked to the first, and then a third linked to both as proof that the story must be true. Apparently, if three far-right blogs make the same charge in the same day, it should be considered fact.”

    … And that’s how truthiness is propagated. Next stop — WaPo and Fox News. The only question is was this the usual Drudge-Politico web of deceit or were these other loyal watercarriers?

  • Ugh. What a sorry state of affairs!

    Today we must look to the city of Las Vegas, Nevada, as a metaphor of our national character and aspiration, its symbol a thirty foot-high cardboard picture of a slot machine and a chorus girl. For Las Vegas is a city entirely devoted to the idea of entertainment, and as such proclaims the spirit of a culture in which all public discourse increasingly takes the form of entertainment. Our politics, religion, news, athletics, education and commerce have been transformed into congenial adjuncts of show business, largely without protest or even much popular notice. The result is that we are a people on the verge of amusing ourselves to death. -Neil Postman, Amusing Ourselves to Death

  • No Rethug can ever have anything but good results in slamming on the media. Facts be damned. Rudi’s target audience will eat this stuff up. When lying works, why bother with the truth? (oh sure, there are things like morals and conscience, but these are R’s we’re talking about!)

  • I wonder how much NYT charges Rev Moon for his — also full page – ads. Bet it’s at a very hefty discount, since he’s a repeat offen… er, customer. Regular as a bowel movement.

    And for those who don’t read the paper copy of NYT: MoveOn’s ad was all black and white; Freedom Watch’s had colour. Not much, but enough to raise the costs.

  • I’m a little confused…if the NYT would not disclose what it charged MoveOn for the ad, where did Tapper get his info that the cost was $65,000? Did MoveOn tell him that? Are we to believe that he took the word of some – gasp! – blog?

    It’s bad enough that the right loves the game of “Gossip,” but worse that allegedly credible media outlets and now presidential candidates are picking it up and turning it into some kind of reality.

    What would make me laugh is if MoveOn had an invoice showing that it had paid more than the going rate and ventured that the NYT would probably be happy to charge Mr. Giuliani that rate for any ad he wanted to run…

    Rudy Giuliani is an idiot.

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  • Rudy only has glass in drag. btw…the add was supposed to run on the day Petraeus testified…it wasn’t unintentional. The right should drown in their own ridiculous drool. Exactly how much did the “swift boat” campaign cost again? Rudy is such a smug kiss ass who has been bought and sold so many times he can’t keep his own lies straight.

  • Okay, my parents were editors in the Newhouse chain and news staff had absolutely nothing to do with advertising staff, they were on different floors and didn’t even know each other. Assuming this rather sensible policy is also true at the NY Times, how is this conspiracy supposed to have taken place?

  • I’m a little confused…if the NYT would not disclose what it charged MoveOn for the ad, where did Tapper get his info that the cost was $65,000? Did MoveOn tell him that?”

    From Reuters Article: Moveon.org confirmed it paid $65,000 for the full page ad headlined “General Petraeus or General Betray Us.”

  • Wow, if these wingnuts insist on going through with the offer, I think they just made some NY Times ad exec very happy. But who am I kidding? They just said that as a rhetorical stunt; imagining they made some killer point, no doubt.

  • John Stewart did a little segment last night called “You’re Not Helping” and showed that clip of the Code Pink protest at start of the Patraeus hearings earlier in the week. I had to laugh out loud but me, I usually preface that with “I know you mean well but…” I also tend to regard the Code Pinks of the world as pretty harmless in general. I mean I feel bad for them and if that sort of thing makes them feel better, it’s probably better for them than antidepressants.

    But much as I have every confidence that MoveOn’s intentions are also solid gold, unlike Code Pink they have access to the kind of money it takes to turn their bad ideas into some really big messes. MoveOn started out as a great idea and I’ve pitched in a little money here and there on some of their earlier efforts myself. But as far as I’m concerned, they’ve long since passed the point where I frankly think they should change their name to Loose CannOn.

    It did occur to me however that there was one possible benefit from their latest cock-up that I had overlooked. With all the praise being heaped on David Patraeus from the right, looking to make the most of the opening the MoveOn ad provided of course, it may just be harder for Bush to use the commanding general switcheroo again to buy more time for his dirty little war. After all, if someone with David Patraeus’ godlike righteousness and superhuman abilities can’t bring order to Iraq, what hope would any mere mortal have?

  • “Ah, conservative wit. Is there anything more humorous?”

    Dunno. Certainly not liberal wit:

    “you know you might as well reach for the Maalox.”

    “Rudy were to show some class he’d likely have an aneurism.”

    “FreedumbWatch.lie”

    “Rethug”

    “Rudy Giuliani is an idiot”

    “Rudy is such a smug kiss ass”

    I guess left-wing clowns are funnier than right-wing clowns. Their innate, holier than thou elitism somehow makes them appear more, well, clownish.

  • I don’t like Rudy at all, but how is this any worse than what moveon.org did? Both are rather distasteful to me as a fairly liberal person, but I think moveon.org will sustain greater damage to their reputation from their ad, because it alienated those who aren’t so far left they can’t see reality anymore.

  • I’m really tired of the concern-trolling about “oh, tsk tsk, MoveOn damaged the left’.

    MoveOn took a stand. Told the truth. Made a bold and unpopular, and unpleasant statement: Petraeus is lying to us. Well, he is lying to us!

    Bravo MoveOn! Keep up the good work. Yeah, they do it in with a bludgeon, not exactly subtle or nuanced, but you know what? Democrats have been doing nuance for 30 years and where has it gotten them?

    I like Howard Dean. I like Kos, Atrios, and CB. I like Michael Moore. I like MoveOn. I like people who have the balls to be blunt and speak truth to power. I don’t give a shit how “shrill” they come off. Somebody’s gotta do it.

  • I love the quality of the Times’ writing – pure clear often sublime – but their decision making has frequently left much to be desired. They chose to publish an attack ad before the testimony was delivered. This act drove me to cancel my subscription. I know that they will not miss my few dollars a week, but I suspect that I am one of many that have chosen this small protest.

    Since I doubt the psychic ability of MoveOn, I assume they had made up their minds before anything was said. How very closed minded of them. I would have though that listening to the testimony then crafting a response would have made them seem less rabid in their single minded hatred of anything associated with President Bush, the military or news that does not meet their requirements for conformance to their odd brand of orthodoxy. If Moore, Dean, Hillary, Barak or any other member of the pantheon of the left would have the temerity to violate MoveOn’s canons, I believe that they they too would receive the same treatment.

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