Reid calls Gen. Pace ‘incompetent,’ causes far-right apoplexy

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid held a conference call with some liberal bloggers this week (I was not, for the record, on this call) and, according to a Politico report, the senator had some mild-but-unkind words for some high-profile U.S. generals.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid called Marine Gen. Peter Pace, the outgoing chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, “incompetent” during an interview Tuesday with a group of liberal bloggers, a comment that was never reported.

Reid made similar disparaging remarks about Army Gen. David Petraeus, the top U.S. commander in Iraq, said several sources familiar with the interview.

The article is a little short on details, including the context of Reid’s remarks, a response from Reid’s office, or any kind of examples Reid might have shared during the conference call to bolster his assessment. All we know is that someone who heard the call told one reporter one disparaging word about Gen. Pace. It feels a little thin.

Conservatives don’t see it that way. You can peruse some of the far-right blog responses here, but this is a good example: “People who serve in our military do so at great sacrifice and risk. And they do the best they can under screwed up priorities and naive concepts that eminate [sic] from Congress like swamp gas. It is bad enough when the partisans are so poisoned that a man who did a fine job against a tough enemy is forced to step aside because of politics. But that is not an [sic] green light for personal attacks on our military members in a time of war.”

John McCain’s presidential campaign, perhaps sensing an opportunity, decided to try and get in on the fun. McCain released a press statement saying that it’s “incredibly disappointing that Harry Reid would make such disparaging remarks about both the highest ranking officer in the U.S military and the commander of our troops in Iraq. Gens. Pace and Petraeus are two leaders who have spent their entire lives in service to their country, and Sen. Reid needs to clarify his criticisms, which can only be described as highly inappropriate and regrettable.”

I realize that Harry Reid has quickly become Public Enemy #1 to the far-right, but all of this outrage seems wildly misplaced.

First, Reid may have questioned Pace’s competence on a private conference call, but it was Bush who fired Pace rather then have him defend the administration’s war policy. All things being equal, if conservatives have formed a We Love Peter Pace Fan Club, they should direct some ire towards the White House and the Pentagon, not Reid’s office.

Second, Reid’s comments — which, again, amount to a one-word quote — were not a “personal attack.” He questioned Pace’s competence. He’s not the first. It’s hardly scandalous.

Third, since when is it heresy to question the competence of military leaders? Pace’s tenure has, at times, been rocky. His relationship with congressional leaders has, at times, been awkward. For that matter, Petraeus’ judgment has come under question of late. There need not be a rule that military leaders must remain criticism-free at all times. As Kevin Drum explained, “General officers who support lousy policies deserve brickbats, and plenty of them have done just that in the Iraq war. If Reid has legitimate criticisms to offer, there’s nothing out of line about offering them.”

And fourth, if generals must be exempted from criticism, and those who spend their lives in military service should not be questioned, why is it that John McCain offered some harsh words, in public, for the last general to command U.S. troops in Iraq?

Opposing Gen. George Casey’s confirmation as the Army’s chief of staff, McCain cited the general’s “unrealistically rosy” assessments and “failed leadership” and told him: “I question seriously the judgment that was employed in your execution of your responsibilities in Iraq. And we have paid a very, very heavy price in American blood and treasure because of what is now agreed to by literally everyone as a failed policy.”

Was this outrageous, too? Did conservatives condemn McCain for levying a “personal attack” on a general “in a time of war”? Was it “inappropriate and regrettable” for McCain to publicly blast a man who spent his entire life in service to his country?

Or is it more likely the case that Republicans are desperate to manufacture scandals about Democrats, whether the facts support them or not?

Version ll:

Give ’em Hell Harry!

Remember when HST fired the pompous General MacArthur?
Oh the right-wing rage!

Suggestion:

Read Steve Clemons post on General Pace.
He is a MacArthur…. minus the military talent.

nuf said…

  • The story here isn’t about Reid or whether anything he did was unusual or scandalous, as CB has pointed out. The real story is how effectively the right-wing noise machine that manufactures these stories can drive the whole media narrative for the country, almost unchallenged outside of the liberal blogosphere.

  • Reid fucked up. It’s the president who’s incompetent. The generals are just doing their best with the orders they’ve been given.

    This will not play well for Dems. They should get a new Majority Leader.

  • I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole thing was fabricated. However, I had to point out how much I love comments like this one:

    “But that is not an [sic] green light for personal attacks on our military members in a time of war.”

    I guess if we weren’t at war, you could call any of them sons of bitches, and no one would give a shite!

  • The Administration has been working their way down the list to whoever was willing to give them an enthusiastic “Yaas Boss” from day one. Rumsfeld forced the best and the brightest out of the Army and Marine Corps years ago. A lot of what remains of the senior Officer’s Corps are people who are willing to sell out their sworn duty (to say nothing of their country and their troopers) in exchange for another star. In fairness there are also those who stay on because they feel it is their duty to try and minimize the damage – they don’t generally get to stand out front.

    Incompetents generally look for other incompetents to promote. It’s how the maintain their delusions of adequacy . . .

    Reid didn’t fuck up. He’s probably dead-on right. If he said it.

  • It’s kind of an inverted (perverted?) version of the notion that the cover-up is worse than the crime. In this case, to hear the right tell it, grand, fatal, costly incompetence on a scale never before seen is just dandy. But pointing out said incompetence is a sin of epic proportions.

  • Talk about “You can’t handle the truth.”

    When will these arse-hats figure out that very few people care what they think? Whether Reid said it or not, I file this puddle of spewings from the fRightWank Whinge-o-Tronic with “racist, sexist attacks” on Lurita Doan.

  • These Reich Wing Authoritarians that like to perpetuate the idea that members of the U.S. Military are infallible are setting up our Constitutional republic for a fall.

    WE DO NOT LIVE UNDER A MILITARY DICTATORSHIP!

    It is not the soldier, as Fred Thompson blathered in his anti-patriotic diatribe, that grants us our freedom or democracy or liberty or independence or our Constitutional republic. Neither is it the government. Neither is it the President or the members of Congress. Neither was it the Framers of the Constitution.

    It is WE, THE PEOPLE, who established THE CONSTITUION of the United States. And, it is WE, THE PEOPLE, who ALL of the power of our government and, indeed, our military is vested in.

    As Abraham Lincoln said in his Gettysburg Address:

    Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

    But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate — we can not consecrate — we can not hallow — this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us — that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion — that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain — that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

  • I hope my history here will provide me some heat shield on this, but I have a somewhat dissenting opinion. I do not think Pace and Petraeus are brilliant, nor above criticism. And I certainly think the Right and its Noise Machine are both hypocticial and unfairly allowed to influence the debate in this country. And I have, in general, favored Dems in Congress being tougher on Rethugs.

    In this instance, however, if Reid really said that in anything near the way reported, he screwed up.

    Situational analysis is part of leading. While we should work to change the Right’s stranglehold on the media, it is a reality, part of the hand we are dealt and have to play. And simply calling someone “incompetent” is hardly reasoned discourse. I disagree some with CB; I do think that can be a personal attack. You are not saying “the decision to work with Sunni warlords is shameful,” you are saying that the individual is incompetent. That seems pretty personal (which doesn’t automatically make it wrong, but if you go personal you (a) raise the stakes in the debate, and (b) it helps if you do so in a more articulate and reasoned way than one-word labels). Reid should know he is becoming a lightning rod, and has a target on his back. When Dr. Dean started his DNC term that way, he learned to tone it down and has become more effective. Reid needs to do the same — he ends up stepping on the story, which should be the latest BushCo scandal.

    We should no more knee-jerk defend ours than the right should knee-jerk defend theirs. Sorry, but on some of his latest outbursts – particularly where he seems to talk tough but can’t get the Senate to actually be tough on the White House – color me unimpressed.

  • These Reich Wing Authoritarians that like to perpetuate the idea that members of the U.S. Military are infallible

    If they gave a fuck about members of the USAS they would be all over BushCo for treating them like crap. They would’ve abandoned BushCo in droves when they started swiftboating Kerry and absolutely shit diamonds over the purple heart band-aid stunt. The Reichers just use members of the armed forces as a prop, or in this case, a shield, against critisism.

    WE DO NOT LIVE UNDER A MILITARY DICTATORSHIP!

    If we did, Bush and his ilk would last about five seconds. But still, a military dictatorship would be a bad thing.

  • Or is it more likely the case that Republicans are desperate to manufacture scandals about Democrats, whether the facts support them or not?

    They certainly seem desperate to distract attention. They’ve been whining so much about how awful it is that Scooter has been sentenced and must go to prison while his appeals go forward that they’ve now got the cable channels (or at least CNN) openly exploring what it would take to issue a pardon and how likely it is to happen. Amid all the tears about how hard this will be on him and his family, I don’t hear a single word about how Valerie Plame’s family has suffered nor anything about the danger her “outing” caused to her undercover associates. But, you know, IOKIYAR.

  • OK, IIRC, Bush said (twice, at least) that we had to attack Iraq because Sadaam would not let the inspectors back into country. Mitt Romney said the same thing in a debate. Not a peep, not a G-D peep from the wingers or the MSM about this.
    But Reid (maybe, maybe) said an unflattering word about a general that has led a clusterfuck of a campaign, and NOW this is something to get perturbed about?
    WTF?
    IOKIYAR!?!
    I think Jay & Silent Bob had the right idea, go around the country finding these assholes & kicking their nuts into their throats.
    Lets start with Ann Coulter.

  • I know its not just me, but everyone of these conservative talking heads (posteriors?) wants the military to attack someone somewhere to “protect” us from the terrorists, the communists, the you name it. Almost to a man they are children of wealth who never lifted a finger to serve their country. Kristol, Limbaugh, and others.

    Next time we have a war, we should draft them and their families to be on the front lines. I won’t even think about contadicting someone who has defended our county.

    I work with a number of people who are Guard and Reserve, I respect their opinions about Iraq. They’ve been there and I haven’t. I have seen a majority of them move from rabid supporters to wanting the troops out.

  • Actually, beep52 is right on the money. Consider one thing, and just one thing:

    We know how good the Reich noise machine works in times of dissent by any portion of the People. The worse things get, the louder they squeal—and the closer to the Truth the People get, the more shrill the verbal “look-over-there” finger pointing becomes.

    But how might these squalid, festering bullies react if their “opposite number” chose to adopt the same tactics they themselves employ? Neither to counter Lies with Lies nor to counter Greed and Graft with Greed and graft, but rather to counter Anger with Anger?

    If the judge that convicts Libby can face death-threats, then those who argue that a convictred criminal should be pardoned might also be faced with such “covert” violence. If a sitting Senator who shows up for work every day and points out that a particular general’s performance is less than spectacular can be victimized, then what about the sitting Senator who leads the attack on the victim, but rarely shows up for work at all?

    For every punch that Dems take, they need to land three or four in return.

    For every stupid word that comes out of Rampstrike McCaca’s gaping hole, a full paragraph needs to shoved down his throat. The same with Giuliani, SnowFlake, Bu$h, Cheney, Rove, and Rice. The same with their precious little noise machine—and their corporate sponsors. Use money as the GOP has used it—as a weapon of mass destruction.

    Do not simply trade blow for blow and salvo for salvo; rather, open the floodgates and pound these idiots mercilessly. Rip them open. Tear their political guts out and leave them in the scorching sun for the buzzards to feast upon. Malice. Intent. Fight to the finish.

    Then, watch them quiver, quake, and cry out for mercy—but do not give it to them.

    Crush. Them. Now.

  • Pace was out of line commenting on government policy.

    Bush is guilty of high crimes and misdemeanours with regard to his own actions concerning Iraq.

    Neither is competent.

    Fire them both.

    Are the right wing blowhards offended? To bad – let them put on a uniform and report to Iraq. Starting an unnecessary war and then loosing it is the definition of incompetence.

    Reid is just telling the truth. About time. He needs our support.

    Our country will not get back on track until most of Washington pulls their heads out of their a$$es and starts telling the truth.

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