The challenge of taking the unserious seriously

Jonah Goldberg seems a little peeved that his yet-to-be-published book, Liberal Fascism: The Totalitarian Temptation from Mussolini to Hillary Clinton, isn’t being taken more seriously.

In an NRO item yesterday, Goldberg defends his forthcoming book as “groundbreaking.” Goldberg seems genuinely disappointed that his critics haven’t been “thoughtful” enough in their analyses. He told Tim Noah that the book is “a very serious, thoughtful, argument that has never been made in such detail or with such care.”

I suppose this shouldn’t come as a complete surprise. Every few months, a far-right writer will publish an inflammatory screed, give it an over-the-top title intended to be provocative and offensive, and then express dismay at the reaction. “This is a book of powerful ideas and intellectual vision,” they say. “Why won’t the left engage in serious debate?”

It happened with Ramesh Ponnuru’s The Party of Death, Dinesh D’Souza’s Enemy at Home, and now with Liberal Fascism.

Part of me suspects this would be frustrating. A writer pours a considerable amount of energy and resources into a book, hoping that it will spur conversation and debate.

But Goldberg seems confused, I’m afraid, about reasonable expectations. As Matt Yglesias explained, “The book is in no way intended to be a serious commentary deserving of serious responses from serious liberals.”

Is it fair to dismiss an unread, unpublished book like this? Actually, yes.

Consider: The cover image is a smiley face with a Hitler moustache drawn on it. The subtitle is The Totalitarian Temptation from Mussolini to Hillary Clinton. The publicity material states clearly that “LIBERAL FASCISM will elicit howls of indignation from the liberal establishment–and rousing cheers from the Right.” Everything about the book, in short, suggests that it’s just meant to poke liberals in the eye in order to provoke howls of rage that will, thereby, garner higher sales on the theory that all conservatives really care about is pissing off liberals. Which is fine, if that’s what Goldberg wants to do.

But, obviously, if you make it clear that you’re not interested in a serious discussion of the issues at hand you’re not going to generate a serious discussion of the issues at hand. I’ll note for the record that Sherri Berman makes a provocative argument about the relationship of fascism to contemporary social democracy in The Primacy of Politics: Social Democracy and the Making of Europe’s Twentieth Century, although she does so specifically in the context of arguing for what I would regard is an exaggerated account of the distinctiveness of social democracy from liberalism.

Goldberg has been around politics for a long while; he’s not naïve. Writing a book called Liberal Fascism is not about challenging ideological rivals to scholarly debate about policy and philosophy. Comparing Hillary Clinton to Mussolini is not serious. Putting a Hitler mustache on a smiley face is not serious.

Frankly, we’ve all seen this game before. Regnery publishes a screed, Heritage & Co. push it onto the best-sellers list, serious people ignore what is obviously a shallow polemic, and National Review whines about the reaction.

Must we go through this every few months?

“Must we go through this every few months?” Alas, yes. The right-wing writers are so full of themselves that they cannot see the obvious.

If one publishes a right-wing screed with titles as stupid as those used by Goldberg and Ponuru, all one winds up eliciting from liberals is a laugh followed by a yawn.

When they get serious, we’ll get serious.

  • “This is a book of powerful ideas and intellectual vision,” they say.

    Hmm…some half-witted guy with a funky moustache said the same thing about a similar book, about 80 years ago. Gave it a catchy title, too:

    “Mein Kampf.”

    Oh well—back to the pipeline….

  • How anyone can consider Lucianne’s favorite pear-shaped, prematurely bald little squinter even a “typist” let alone a “writer” is beyond me. Further proof of the abject failure of home-schooling.

  • Please don’t waste any more virtual ink on Jonah Goldberg. He is an meanspirited, obnoxious immature jerk who deserves to be ignored. Goldberg surely wouldn’t give serious thought to a book written by a liberal. The wingnuts would cut off his funding if he did.

  • Liberal Fascism is an oxymoron. Goldberg need look no further than the Bush Administration for an example of Fascism, and it sure as hell isn’t liberal. Always count on conservatives to accuse liberals of what they themselves are doing. It’s an old, often effective resurrected by the Bolsheviks and perfected by Joe Goebbles. I like all the suggested responses posted here. Best to laugh at Goldberg’s ridiculous title(let alone his book) and ignore the spoiled little snot.

  • Goldberg’s irritation is all part of the act. When no one gives his ideas any credence, it is part of a conspiracy. His true audience eats that shit up.

  • “Must we go through this every few months?”

    Because the machine must be fed. The machine’s purpose is to be a Make Work Project for RW turds who would otherwise be unemployable.

    Why is such a valiant “warrior” not walking the streets of Iraq on a foot patrol is beyond me.

  • “Must we go through this every few months?”

    Remember, CB, only you can let them get to you.

  • Since we’re already talking about fascists and Hillary and Mussolini, I guess it’s okay to mention the Nazis.

    In the years before Hitler became Chancellor, I’m guessing there were more than a few Germans who dismissed the Nazis as fringe lunatics not to be taken seriously. That, of course, changed in fairly short order. Now, I wouldn’t equate Goldberg with the Nazis, but the fact remains that he and those like him have a very different vision of what democracy should be, and they’re quite determined to make that vision a reality.

    Keeping tabs on Ponnuru, D’Souza, Goldberg and their ilk may be a pain in the ass, but not taking them seriously could also have its downside. I mean, who among us thought we’d witness the goings on of the past 6 years back when Gingrich was waving around that contract thing of his. What a lunatic.

  • What I don’t understand is how Goldberg can been upset when he said nothing about the utter silence that greeted the publication of my groundbreaking and incisive analytical work “Bushista: How Having Monkeys Fly Out Of Your Butt Proves Your God-given Right to Rule”. Such a serious, thoughtful argument of the relationship of simian extrusion to modern, post-9/11 political theory has never been made in such detail or with such care. Yet, no one, NO ONE, has engaged it seriously. And Jonah ignored it completely.

    It’s always all about him with Jonah, isn’t it?

  • A writer pours a considerable amount of energy and resources into a book, hoping that it will spur conversation and debate.

    Over the last few years, I’ve noticed the subtitles of these sorts of books getting longer and longer. What once might have read Hilary Clinton: Why She’s Bad is now more likely to bear a title like Hilary Clinton: How She Kicks Babies and Eats Puppies. It occured to me that not only are these books not likely to spur debate, they’re not even expected to be purchased. Instead, they are supposed to sit on the front table at the Border’s or the Barnes & Noble, where everyone entering the store will see them, and read those titles.

    Sure, those of us paying attention roll our eyes and move on to the real books. But some customers will file that away without realizing it. Two months later the subject of Hilary Clinton comes up at the water cooler, and they say, “Gee, I don’t know. I read somewhere that she kicks babies and eats puppies.”

    They’re like billboards for conservative talking points — disguised so you’ll pick up those points without realizing what they are. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised to learn that it cost less than a full-on billboard campaign. (Of course, the bulk sales to wingnut organizations defrays some of the cost.)

  • I know it’s wrong of me, but when these wingnut books show up on the New Books shelf at my local library I make sure they are relocated to the Zoology shelves.

  • Well what else is BushBrat supposed to put in his Prezidentyall Libbery? I mean even Chimpy McFlightsuit must realize that miles of shelves stocked with nothing but My Pet Goat would look a little funny.

    tAiO

    p.s. Bravo Dale! Stick them in among the books on parasites.

  • Hey, they have to hand out SOMETHING for wingnuts to take home from those CPAC/Klan rallies.

    And think of how bare those bookstores at the factory outlet malls would be.

    Of course, this is all Al Franken’s fault.

  • Speaking of the serious v. the unserious-

    How many women Democratic staffers, liberal women in journalism, and women liberal social activists in DC do you think have actually fellated a guy who they thought was a liberal but actually wasn’t, or at least thought wasn’t dating them just to manipulate them, but actually was?

    Sort of to have a contact that the guy’s bosses can alway have him swoop in to give bad advice or encourage it to be given, or for a hook-up when the woman is running low on time before a big deadline, needs her life otherwise disrupted, or is about to get into a relationship with a real liberal guy?

    Sure conservatives wouldn’t want liberals to have families, be seen as having families, or see themselves as having families- to have a stable community of friends, rather than a group of friends that is constantly cheating on, cuckholding, and divorcing each other. And who cares if you wanted to have real relationships and raise kids? Messing up your life is a fun way for a conservative to make the world what they see as a better place and only hurts a person who they think doesn’t really count.

    I always ask myself, Would they do it if someone suggested it? and if the answer is yes, my guess is they did it.

    Would you think that was serious?

  • Seems like it wasn’t that long ago that the right wing noise machine was all up in arms up anyone who dared mention Bush in the same sentence as Hitler or who dared to point out the obvious similarities of GOP policies and methods to that of the Nazis. But now, it’s supposed to be ok in polite and serious discouse to compare Hillary Clinton to Mussolini?

    oh, and I don’t consider anything posted by blogwhores to be serious.

  • I know it’s wrong of me, but when these wingnut books show up on the New Books shelf at my local library I make sure they are relocated to the Zoology shelves.

    Even better, dump them at the bottom of the trash barrels way back in the stacks. That way they go to the landfill sooner and at least serve some useful purpose. Another good one is to just steal them and forget to return them.

  • In the years before Hitler became Chancellor, I’m guessing there were more than a few Germans who dismissed the Nazis as fringe lunatics not to be taken seriously. That, of course, changed in fairly short order.

    I always remember Billy Wilder telling me the story of how he got out of Germany. His friends had finally considered him a crank on the topic of the Nazis because he constantly pointed at them as the threat they were. So on the night that Hitler won the 1933 election, he packed everything he owned into a steamer trunk, called a cab and went to the Berlin Train Station where he bought a one-way ticket on the Berlin-Paris Express, leaving at dawn. “I didn’t come back for twelve years, and when I did, all my friends who had called me an alarmist were dead.”

    That’s what happens when we fail to recognize these scum as the far right revolutionaries they consider themselves to be. We’re always caught up with “Geez, I didn’t think it was possible they’d do that…” Well, that’s what happens when you don’t recognize the truth about the enemy.

    These people do have to be watched as the traitors they are.

  • Not to blogwhore here, but Glenn Greenwald puts it well today, talking about these people:

    One can dismiss people like this if one wants, but their views have been far closer to what the White House ends up doing than anyone else’s, and the one lesson that everyone ought to have learned by now is that there is no such thing as an idea too extremist or dangerous to be beyond the ken of Bush and company. It is simply fact that, beginning in 2001, one can read what the most wild-eyed neoconservatives say in order to know what Cheney and his comrades are thinking prior to the time they ultimately act.

  • This really reminds me of something I wrote here.

    In the context of these times liberals shouldn’t just ignore it. Your parents may have taught you to respond to trouble like that, but at a certain point it just becomes trying to take the easy way out. The response of the Colberts of the world is a good response- making fun of the other side. They think we’re in some kind of submission-dominance relationship- show them we’re not, and, if we are, we’re going to be on the dominance end of it.

  • Well beep52, if a person really thinks fascist stuff is going on it might not be good for them to talk about it openly because people might be interested in knowing who would believe in stuff like that. It would be rational for a person to decide to say that they don’t think anyone does stuff like that out of self-interest. It depends on what you want to do.

    A word to the wise.

  • If a man is chasing me with an axe, it doesn’t matter to me if he thinks I am a giant chicken. His thinking may be laughable, but the axe is just as deadly.

  • OT: RIGHTWING TRIES TO OPEN MERCENARY BASE IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA!

    “Published on February 22, 2007
    Tiny Potrero Battles County and Blackwater USA
    By Don Bauder

    The hamlet of Potrero in southeast San Diego County, 45 miles from the city and just 8 minutes from Tecate, is being ambushed. The attackers are county bureaucrats marching alongside Blackwater USA…”

    http://www.sdreader.com/php/cityshow.php?id=1566

    Gee, I wonder which side they will fight on in the upcoming civil war?

    Austrian fascist comes to California, steals elections, and greenlights SS base. What a surprise.

  • The title of Goldberg’s book automatically excludes it from serious consideration. Goldberg knows that. A public uproar about his book is money in his pocket. Don’t play along. Don’t dignify it. For now, just hope it dies a lonely death in the castoff bin. If the book has success, then address it’s ‘ideas’ and bemoan the fact that many are so incredibly naive, but dont inadvertently go on a publicity tour for the book, when no action is the best action.

  • If the left doesnt dignify Goldberg’s rant, possibly causing some who would not otherwise buy a book with such an assinine title to do so, then it is reasonable to assume that anyone who buys the book is a lost cause anyway.

  • Well beep52, if a person really thinks fascist stuff is going on it might not be good for them to talk about it openly because people might be interested in knowing who would believe in stuff like that. It would be rational for a person to decide to say that they don’t think anyone does stuff like that out of self-interest. It depends on what you want to do.

    If a person wasn’t street wise, or was even a complete idiot, they might expect everyone they’re friends with to always speak completely straight with them, no matter what.

  • My impression of Goldberg, formed during an email spat, is that he’s very much like one of those terribly precocious 10-year-olds who turns up in Hollywood comedies now and then. He doesn’t think he’s funny. He takes himself very, very seriously. So I guess he didn’t mean the title as a joke! And (worse) he can’t understand why intelligent people from right to left might be laughing at it!

    That said, I agree with Tom Cleaver (19, 20). Particularly having just read the article in tomorrow’s NYTimes about the NYPD’s behaviors before and during the Republican convention in 2004. Look over your shoulders, bloggers…

  • Goldberg’s a nonentity who owes his place in the world to a woman who owes her place in the world to Monica Lewinsky.

    He’s not even writing the damn thing. He keeps trying to find someone who’ll do his research for him, collect his “notes” for him, and edit the mess into something resembling a coherent manuscript for him. Good luck with that, kid.

  • Goldberg? Groundbreaking?!?! I’ll grant the Cheetoh stained, doughy pantload as windbreaking, but that’s as far as I’ll go.

  • “Liberal Fascism”? Fascism is by definition a nationalist, right-wing ideology. Mussolini was not a leftist. Mussolini advocated a synergy between bellicose nationalists, fellow travelers in the business community, the military, and the church working in concert to enforce a specific non-democratic ideology kept in place through coercion and violence. This sounds very much like a country people like Goldberg would enjoy living in.

  • “definition a nationalist, right-wing ideology”

    I will save some right wing lap dog the time and trouble.

    ” But NAZI has the word Socialist in it so it has to be a Leftist gorup.”

  • When there was the USSR, Liberals (anyone who wasn’t Republican) were pinko Commies (Stalinists) who were turning America into a Socialist nation. Now Liberals are Fascists? Not only are those two words, Liberal/Fascist, oxymoronic, but so are Stalinist/Fascist and Socialist/Fascist. The hardcore Right will call whoever is their target of the moment by any label that they think will get a rise (and money) from their loyalists. Truth and logic have nothing to do with what they are saying; moronic does.
    Also
    Perhaps the Corporate, Fascist, press is finally getting tired of bashing Hillary. It has been going on relentlessly since 1990-91. If she survives through the Democratic primaries and is nominated, what will they have left to say; what lies and exaggerations which they have not already used; who will be left who has any interest in the lies, exaggerations, slander, and just plain bitchiness of their attacks?
    (Don’t remind them, but Bill’s popularity rose as the stupidity and viciousness of the Republican’s pursuit of Monica-gate went on and on. They may end up doing the same favor for Hillary.)
    March 24, 2007
    The challenge of taking the unserious seriously
    The Carpetbagger

  • Jonah is too much of a hack to do anything groundbreaking. That requires independent though and creativity.

  • The only reason Jonah is doing something other than flipping burgers or performing oil changes has to do with his parents getting him his present job. He is without doubt not particularly bright or well educated or even well read.

    And his lumping of Mussolini into the category of “liberal” is simply astounding. Why not toss in Hitler too? As someone above pointed out, it was the National SOCIALIST German Worker’s Party, after all!

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