The plot at Fort Dix

I try not to be a cynical person. When mainstream news outlets report on disrupted terrorist plots, my first instinct isn’t to question the timing or doubt the validity of the report, but rather to cheer.

But when it comes to disrupted plots, the Bush administration’s track record is discouraging. Too often, threats have been irresponsibly hyped far beyond the facts. Like the boy who cried “wolf,” the Bush gang has bred cynicism, making it almost impossible to consider news like this at face value.

Six “Islamic radicals” involved in a plot to kill U.S. soldiers at Fort Dix in New Jersey were arrested Monday night, the U.S. attorney’s office in New Jersey said Tuesday.

One of the suspects was born in Jordan, another in Turkey, the U.S. attorney’s office said. The rest are believed to be from the former Yugoslavia, “either U.S. citizens or living illegally in the United States,” the office said in a statement.

“Their alleged intention was to conduct an armed assault on the army base and to kill as many soldiers as possible,” according to the statement. […]

The men were planning to use automatic weapons to shoot soldiers at the Army post, according to a federal law enforcement source and a senior government source.

The men, some of whom were related to each other, had been doing surveillance and planning “for a while,” and they trained in the Poconos Mountains in northeastern Pennsylvania, according to the federal law enforcement source. They played paintball and test-fired weapons, a law enforcement source said.

Apparently, the plot was disrupted when the would-be killers videotaped a training session, and brought it to a store to have it burned onto to a DVD. The store clerk saw the video, called the FBI, and agents set up a sting operation, posing as arms dealers, to arrest the suspects.

Obviously, this is a great development and encouraging news. The law enforcement officials who were involved with the arrests, not to mention that store clerk, deserve the nation’s gratitude.

That said, there are a few angles to this story to consider.

First, it’s worth noting that today’s success was due to intelligence gathering and law-enforcement efforts — the very techniques the Bush White House has consistently ridiculed as ineffective in counterterrorism. For that matter, as Steve M. noted, “[A]pparently no warrantless wiretapping led to these arrests, no torture of suspects in overseas prisons, nothing liberals have objected to in the Patriot Act. Remember that when you’re told that these arrests prove that we can’t trust liberals and Democrats.”

Second, the alleged “Islamic radicals” may not have been quite as dangerous as the initial reports had led us to believe.

While authorities are glad to have arrested them, the individuals are “hardly hard core terrorists,” one law enforcement source said.

Another source said that while the allegations are “troubling,” they are “not the type that made the hair on the back of your neck stand up.”

And third, let’s also not forget that just about every disrupted terrorist plot the Bush administration has touted turned out to be far less serious than advertised. The plot to destroy the Brooklyn Bridge wasn’t quite what it was cracked up to be. Jose Padilla was not actually prepared to detonate a dirty bomb in DC. The plot by the “Miami 7” to strike the Sears Tower was billed by Dick Cheney as being “a very real threat” — but the reality was very different.

Moreover, the facts of the British hijacking plot didn’t stand up well to scrutiny, while the plot to attack Los Angeles’ Library Tower turned out to be far less serious than we’d been led to believe.

Obviously, I can appreciate the national security restrictions that prevent administration officials from talking openly about their counter-terrorism successes in any kind of detail, but in recent years, the Bush gang have pointed to about a half-dozen specific thwarted terrorist plots — all of which turned out to be far less serious than the administration claimed.

I’m not saying that the alleged plot at Fort Dix falls into the same category, but I am saying that between the CNN report about the suspects not being “hard core terrorists” and the administration’s track record, one need not be a cynic to be skeptical.

Does this mean we can officially stick a fork in “fight them over there so we don’t have to fight them over here”? Seems like the turrurists didn’t get the message…

Either that or is just more admin bullshit.

  • The really damning evidence against the seriousness of the threat of terrorism is that no Islamic terrorist has pulled something like this off yet (or even tried very often). Given the availability of guns and the myriad places in this country with little or no security (shopping malls, sporting events, college campuses, etc), a suicide terrorist would have no trouble walking into, say, a college campus and killing dozens of people. The inevitable conslusion is that there are very, very few of them out there.

  • “They played paintball and test-fired weapons,” Dear God! This nation is more filled with terrorists than I ever imagined. And don’t forget about all those terrorists in training playing laser tag and Halo on their computers.

    A small group of terrorists attacking an army base in the US? Are you kidding me? That’s like a criminal breaking into a prison to rob it. It makes no sense. So terrorists are trying to kill soldiers over here before they kill them over there? Anything this stupid has Republican written all over it.

  • The whole idea behind terrorism is the terrorists attack soft targets where lack of preparedness renders unarmed civilians relatively easy to kill. I think these paintball warriors were a little unclear on the concept.

  • Amen, petorado. If we were going to arrest every bunch of Rambo wannabees who play paintball and shoot off guns up in the hills now and then, we’d have to build a whole new series of prisons just to hold them all.

    Talk about desperation. The White House has reached the dregs and kept right on going.

  • The act of paying for a video to be converted onto a DVD isn’t really supportive of any theory alleging these guys were particularly dangerous. At first glance, this story reminds me of those guys who were arrested for buying prepaid phones last year. Curious national attention with specifics that proved to be false upon further inspection.

    With that case and others in mind, it is our duty at this point to be skeptical.

  • “If we were going to arrest every bunch of Rambo wannabees who play paintball and shoot off guns up in the hills now and then, we’d have to build a whole new series of prisons just to hold them all.”

    Not to mention we’d have to overcome the power of the NRA, who fully supports selling guns to would-be terrorists.

  • I try not to be a cynical person.

    I don’t look at it as being cynical. When soldiers defended Renaissance Italian towns again and again from invaders, who were the heroes? Again and again they were mercenaries, not Sir Lancelot, romantic-style, chivalrous knights, and often the people who hired them ended up having to take measures to defend themselves against their protectors’ own conquering ambitions after they were saved, not even stopping short of violence. Who’s to say that people who save you now aren’t bad guys? I’m sure a lot of mobsters did a lot of people a lot of favors back in their day.

    Pretty often I see myself as an optimistic and idealist person. I once wrote “cynic” below my name on a card that labeled my locker at a law school clinic, so that it read “Constitutional Litigation Cynic” after my name. I never think of myself as a cynic, but I just did it because it was a funny joke, since it rhymed with Constitutional Litigation Clinic. But often we’re in the position of being critical as liberals, which may make us appear cynical. Often I write or say things which may strike people as cynical, but I’m just being realistic, and I think it’s a necessary balance if you’re going to be idealistic and optimistic about the potential for your life and the world around you.

  • What color of terrorist threat level are we at?

    Shouldn’t it be higher???

    Oh wait, that’ll be next year.

  • Idea for new teevee program:

    America’s Stupidest Terrorists.

    Either the Fort Dix Six fit into this category, or the Feds have found bunch of harmless wierdos to harrass.

  • Don’t forget the Lackawana, NY Six and the Ashland, Oregon jihadis.

    BushCo as good as admitted the arrest of the former was arranged out of DC, doubtless timed for electoral reasons, against the wishes of local authorities.

  • shargash #2,

    Amen.
    The VT shooting proves terrorism would not be hard to carry out if Islamists wished to.

    This indicates to me that the American population, Muslim and non-Muslim alike, are very hostile to killing innocents for any reason, holy or otherwise.

  • The rest are believed to be from the former Yugoslavia

    Hmm… Blowback from Clinton’s 1999 bombing of a Belgrade TV station? It’s getting real hard to keep track of the people we’ve killed…

  • I sure hope that all the terrorists are so smart and serious, like these guys, that they decide to surprise all Americans and attack all of our unsuspecting army bases with small groups of men brandishing automatic weapons.

  • “Our fathers came across the prairie. Fought, Indians, fought drought, fought locusts, fought Dix. Remember when Richard Dix came in here and tried to take over this town.”

  • Hear! Hear!

    Police work, not millitary action foilled this plot.

    Apparently, we are fightin’ them over here and as it turns
    out, they are stupid.

    Terrorists do not attack hard targets. They blow up trains, tunnels, markets, buildings, and hijack planes. These six couldn’t even get past the paintball training without being caught and they expected to attack a miliraty installation?

    This whole thing seems like , what is the word(?), Bullshit!

  • Next, they were going to vandalize the Pittsburgh Steelers locker room — during halftime.

  • why is it that news of some people who are considering the possibility of thinking about the possibility of making plans to propose an attack is all over the news, yet i have to dig deep to find out about an ACTUAL BOMB found at an abortion clinic.

  • Let’s see; “6 Islamic terrorists” were going to attack a U.S. military installation with small arms albeit automatic ones. Even so I predict this siege would have been over in about 45 seconds. Also how smart were these guys in the first place if they went to a store to have a DVD formatted from a VHS tape with this kind of content when they could have gone to Best Buy and bought a machine to do it themselves for a couple hundred bucks?

  • I wonder if there is a Jordanian/Turkish equivalent for the names ‘Bubba’ and ‘Skeeter’? Somehow it just feels like these guys would fall under that category, one way or another.

  • Curmudgeon–glad you listed ‘Bubba’ with a capital ‘B’…

    Or the equivalent of “-Bob” as in Joe-Bob, Billy-Bob, Wayne-Bob, or Billy-Joe-Ray-Bob…

  • I would love to see the “training video”, which sounds like it was of some guys playing paintball in the woods.
    Maybe someone could “leak” it to the press?

  • You have no idea what lengths the press went to to bury exculpatory information in the Pelosi plane story. Here is Mike Stark’s account of my attempts over several days to get the Sergeant-at-Arms press release posted on Jake Tapper’s moderated “Political Punch” blog ( http://www.callingallwingnuts.com/2007/02/15/386/ ). To make a long story short: they’d post my snark, not the press release. Then I sent snark with the press release in the post, and they edited out the press release and posted the snark.

    During the time that Tapper and/or subordinate was preventing the press release from seeing the light of day, Tapper was reporting this controversy, knowing full well it was false.

    By the way, Tapper did finally get back to Stark. He claims it was a “glitch”. A glitch that allowed every one of my posts to appear, unless they included the press release? And magically edited the press release out of a post?

    They aren’t being duped, folks. This proves it beyond all doubt.

  • How many of you folks have read the actual criminal complaint filed in the US District Court in New Jersey? Most interesting. The Muslim jihadists had been quite active working on this plot since 2005. They had saved money to buy weapons, and subsequently purchased them. They had maps of Fort Dix – one of them used to deliver pizza there. Also knew how/where to cause power outage on the Fort to make attack easier. They trained in the Pocono Mountains in PA. They wanted to kill as many GIs as possible — hundreds at a time with RPGs. One said: “I’m doing it in the name of Allah” (pg 16, #34). Another wanted secrecy: “…I got five kids, so I don’t wanna go down. People catch me like they think I’m a terrorist” (p.25, #70). The feds have the proof, just read the complaint, especially attachment B. You can find a copy of the complaint here… http://fl1.findlaw.com/news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/terrorism/usduka50707cmp.pdf

  • American Woman,
    You are either very naive or you’re in that 28% who still thinks Bush is doing a good job. I’m sure this complaint reads like the plot in a Tom Clancy novel much like the complaint against Jose Padilla. You all remember him, Jose the jihadist. He worked at Taco Bell during the day wrapping burritos and topping tacos with cheese while at night he was hunkered down in his skeevy apartment designing and building a nuclear device. I wonder how much overtime it would take at Taco Bell to make enough money to buy the parts for this project on the Euro/Asian black market.

  • Judging from the comments of some you would think that US soil has some impenetrable qualities but it does not. Here in the UK 5 men have been convicted of terrorist charges and plotting to blow up venues including a nightclub in London using basic materials such as flour and hair bleech – sounds dumb but the bumd thing would have been to ignore it!!! Read up on this bunch of dumbo’s who did get very close to attacking;
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/terrorism/0,,873826,00.html

    Ethnic-Albanians from Former Yugoslavia = “Kosovars” – you know those wonderful friends of the US whom Clinton bombarded the sovereign state of Serbia into oblivion!!!

    Looks like another case of failed US foreign policy coming home to roost. In the 80’s the CIA trained up the Muhajedin – who would then become Taleban and Al-Queda. Now it would seem that the CIA mission of the mid-ninties of training and abeting the muslim successionist KLA terrorists has created radicalised elements ready to attack US forces on US soil!!!

    Wake up America and smell the coffee – with friends like these “Kosovars” who needs enemies!!!

    Current US foreign policy wants to totally dismember the State of Serbia and reward such radical views with and independent Kosovo – creating another failed state such as Afghanistan but this time in Europe!!! Is it not time someone reflected on earlier mistakes and corrected them before it’s too late!

  • A really smart terrorist would infiltrate government offices, defund the army bases so that many soldiers in the US army lived near or under poverty level, some not able to even make ends meet…

    ….oh wait, that’s already been done.

  • To elp (#29)

    To answer your response: I am not naive, but neither am I sardonic. Unlike some, I try to keep an open mind. I try to face facts, no matter how unpleasant, and refuse to stick my head in the sand or join the appeasement-minded “peace at any price” crowd.

    As to Bush, I agree with some things he does (like attacking al Qaeda), but not with others (such as failing to secure our borders). I don’t buy into the leftwing–Moveon.org–Rosie–MichaelMoore–CindySheehan–SocialistWorkersParty—CommunistPartyUSA—etc., etc. Bush-haters and their “Bush lied…Bush is a Fascist/Nazi/fill in the blank” mantras.

    As to Padilla, I do not know if the case against him is good or not (and neither do you). I will let the judicial process determine that, as well as the current matter of the Fort Dix six. One should note, however, that there undoubtedly are sleeper agents/cells that would be quite happy to build WMD devices — and plenty of other people happy to foot the bill. Muslim fanatics are conducting their global jihad to impose Islam on the world – this war has been going on off and on since the 7th century. To deny this is to deny the plain facts of both history and current happenings world-wide.

  • Since the Ft. Dix Six are no more of a threat than the Dixie Chix why don’t you enlightened individuals show your support for these unfairly treated victims of Bushco by publishing your real names and home addresses on your local faux jihadi site? What’s the worst thing that can happen? Somebody named Abdul will ask you to copy a DVD?

  • Since the Ft. Dix Six are no more of a threat than the Dixie Chix why don’t you enlightened individuals show your support for these unfairly treated victims of Bushco by publishing your real names and home addresses on your local faux jihadi site?
    Comment by Warthog — 5/10/2007 @ 4:11 pm

    Hey moron, nobody that posted on this topic supports these idiots. The whole point is Karl Rove has gone to the well too many times trying to convince people there are al-qaeda jihadists around every corner and that daddy W is going to protect us all and bump up his approval ratings. This bullshit doesn’t wash anymore with the majority of the American people. Most people wouldn’t trust Bush to watch their cat let alone trust him to keep us safe from terrorism given that he has made us less safe with his major clusterfuck in Iraq. Make no mistake about it, Bush and his enablers own this war and no matter how many boogey men they create is going to help Chicken George with his approval ratings. So why don’t you toddle on back to Freeper.com and let the adults have a discussion.

  • The war on terrorism is a total scam. The real terrorist is the United States government. Our government lies about threats and exaggerates dangers to gain more power.

  • Everyone reading this should buy guns and stop paying taxes. America is a police state.

    911 WAS AN INSIDE JOB.

    THE GUILTY MUST PAY.

    BUY GUNS.

  • Jihadists don’t want to blow us up, they just want the USA to be Sharia, no big deal. A very lefty friend of mine said that in light of the ‘Jersey Jihadis’, we should put all Muslims in concentration camps. I was shocked, to say the least.
    .
    absurd thought –
    God of the Universe says
    terrorists must have success
    .
    otherwise they were framed
    in evil government plot
    .

  • Fort dix 6//Lackawana six…how about the tonawanda 2 or the Buffalo 4???? as usual…the Bush/fox news empire is trying to start another terror right in our wallets…GWB is a coward!!! his cronies are stupid…and They should be imprisoned. What an insult to this great nation this admin has been. Our worldwide status has been devoured!

    RE: Laqckawana six…one of it’s ,”members” was what I consider a friend/employee. The man worked for me for 2plus years. I liked him…oh..not really…ugh..I hated him…don’t want the gestapo stopping by my home..LOL (seriously)….

    Instead of wasting time debating the legitimacy of most all the recent “terrorist” arrests….we should concentrate on the REAL CRIMINALS…beginning with the effing numbnuts president….

  • My name is Christian Peper and I was stalked and harassed by military recruiters for taking a picture on public property. At approximately 5:17 PM on Wednesday, January 10, 2007 I, Christian Peper, took a picture of the military recruiting station located nearest to the Office Depot at 4061 Lindell Avenue, St Louis, Missouri, 63108. The nearest cross street is Sarah St. The army recruiting station is located in a store front close to the Office Depot (where I purchased batteries for my digital camera at approximately 5:08PM) and a fast food Mexican restaurant and several other storefronts. The first picture I took was across the street from the recruitment center. I then began to cross the street approaching the recruitment center from the front. I was still standing on a public street named Lindell (not even on the sidewalk) when I took the second picture. As I took the second picture a black male dressed in military uniform (seen in the posted picture) had just exited the recruitment center. I did not set foot on the sidewalk in front of the recruitment center. At no time was I close to the military recruiting center nor did I act in any threatening way. I walked left, towards where my car was parked. He followed me asking why I took the pictures. He repeatedly asked while I took the pictures while he was following me. As I entered the area where my car was parked in the parking lot in front of Office Depot I saw a second man dressed in a military uniform. As I came within about 20 feet of where my car was parked I saw a third man dressed in a military uniform following me. Finally I reached the drivers side of my car. I unlocked the door but they were very close to me (approximately 10 feet) and attempting to swarm around me. At this point I feared my car would be blocked in as I could only back up from the parking space so I decided to leave on foot. I managed to get a distance away from the three men by walking fast towards the end of the parking lot away from the men. As I glanced back I noticed the man in the more dressed up military uniform (not camouflage, probably the supervisor) was indeed standing behind my car putting numbers into his cell phone / computer device recording my license plate. As I continued to speed walk I glanced behind me I noticed that one was still pursuing me after I left the parking lot on foot. This military person finally stopped following me after I was well away from the parking lot. Because I know the area I was able to jog to a friendly place and relax. Apparently the military is now allowed to harass, stalk, and intimidate private citizens. The military has no police authority over private citizens but because of the scam known as the “War on Terrorism” they get away with anything. My constitutional right as an independent journalist to take pictures on public property was infringed.

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