Rove speaks

Because Karl Rove is, well, Karl Rove, many of us have been waiting to hear his no-doubt positive spin on the Republicans’ disastrous midterm elections. Other than being teased publicly by the president, Rove has kept a relatively low profile since Tuesday, but thankfully, he sat down for a chat with Time’s Mike Allen, during which he had all manner of interesting things to say. None of it was persuasive, of course, but it was interesting nevertheless.

For example, Rove has already found some silver linings.

Rove took comfort in results of the Connecticut Senate race between the anti-war Democratic nominee, Ned Lamont, and Sen. Joseph Lieberman, who ran as an independent after losing the Democratic primary over his support for the war. “Iraq mattered,” Rove says. “But it was more frustration than it was an explicit call for withdrawal. If this was a get-out-now call for withdrawal, then Lamont would not have been beaten by Lieberman.”

Rove takes solace in Lieberman’s win? I’ll be the first to admit that Lieberman has strayed too far for comfort, but if Rove is looking for key wins to spin the midterms, shouldn’t he look for actual Republicans? As Digby put it, “How pathetic is it that the great GOP magus is reduced to finding his silver lining in an Independent beating a Democrat in a blue state?”

Perhaps my favorite quote from the piece is when Rove told Allen, “My job is not to be a prognosticator.” No, of course not. His job is to suggest he’s found a secret math that gives him insights that mere mortals can’t comprehend.

From an NPR interview with NPR’s Robert Siegel shortly before the elections:

SIEGEL: We are in the home stretch though and many would consider you on the optimistic end of realism about…

ROVE: Not that you would exhibit a bias, you just making a comment.

SIEGEL: I’m looking at all the same polls that you are looking at.

ROVE: No, you are not. I’m looking at 68 polls a week for candidates for the US House and US Senate, and Governor and you may be looking at 4-5 public polls a week that talk attitudes nationally.

SIEGEL: I don’t want to have you to call races…

ROVE: I’m looking at all of these Robert and adding them up. I add up to a Republican Senate and Republican House. You may end up with a different math but you are entitled to your math and I’m entitled to THE math.

SIEGEL: I don’t know if we’re entitled to a different math but your…

ROVE: I said THE math.

Rove also bought into the historical-trend myth.

Rove is famous for his political statistics, and his team has come up with an array of figures to contend that the Republicans’ loss of 29 seats in the House and six in the Senate is not so out of whack with the historic norms. In all sixth year midterms, the President’s party has lost an average of 29 House seats and 3 Senate seats, according to these figures. In all sixth-year midterms since World War II, the loss was an average of 31 House and 6 Senate seats. And in all wartime midterms since 1860, the average loss was 32 House and 5 Senate seat.

Kevin debunked this before the elections even happened.

And, finally, Rove argued that the GOP was this close to winning the whole cycle.

A shift of 77,611 votes would have given Republicans control of the House, according to Bush’s political team. And a shift of 2,847 votes in Montana, or 7,217 votes in Virginia, or 41,537 votes in Missouri would have given a Republicans control of the Senate. In addition, the party has calculated that the winner received 51 percent or less in 35 contests, and that 23 races were decided by two percentage points or fewer, 18 races were decided by fewer than 5,000 votes, 15 races were decided by fewer than 4,000 votes, 10 races were decided by fewer than 3,000 votes, eight were decided by fewer than 2,000 votes and five races were decided by fewer than 1,000 votes.

Yes, and if 60,000 votes in Ohio switched, Kerry would be president. And if all the votes in Florida had been counted, Gore would have been president.

As Michael Crowley put it, “No moving the goalposts when the other team has the ball!”

“We would have won the war if we hadn’t been stabbed in the back by the Jews and the Socialists!”

Never mind that it was the German Generals who sued for peace to the Kaiser after the Allies breached the Hindenburg Line with overhwelming superiority. After the war, it was “stabbed in the back.” This is why the Allies decided 20 years later that this time Germany would be thoroughly defeated in detail, which put an end to the mythology.

That’s the goal for 2008: 27 at-risk Republican Senators, and at least all those other than the Confederate Traitors go down. Democratic President. A House that doesn’t even need to pay attention to anything the righties say. Defeat of the anti-American fascist right in detail.

  • “I’m entitled to THE math” — i.e., my way or the highway. Well, Karl, there’s the on-ramp for the highway to nowhere. Amazing what happens to wizards when someone pulls the curtain back, isn’t it?

  • I agree with #1 Cleaver. I hope we can put a stake through the heart of the theofascist menace.

    ROVE: I’m looking at all of these Robert and adding them up. I add up to a Republican Senate and Republican House. You may end up with a different math but you are entitled to your math and I’m entitled to THE math.

    Now there’s a quote for the ages. THE math meets THE reality.

  • I’m entitled to THE math.
    Too bad it was the wrong math Karl.

    He needs to knock off those weekly meth disposal sessions with sHaggard. At this rate Rove to crunch the numbers with THE math and discover the Republicons really did win the elections, the Democrats have invaded the Senate and tell Shrubby to send in the soldiers.

  • Karl was desperately pumping the Republican “we create our own reality” meme by insisting that everybody but him was wrong. Whether it was just a ploy to trick the voting public with false optimism or simple self-delusion we’ll probably never know.

    But the whole ‘Gott Mit Uns’ right wing fantasy has now gone down in flames like the Hindenburg and that has probably shaken them more than anything else. Their coalitions are fracturing, their Christo-fascist initiatives are being rejected. All in all, not a good week for the destroyers of civilization as we know it.

    Not that they would ever admit it, of course. They never admit to anything that they don’t like.

  • Here’s a prognostication: When Sen. John Warner of Virginia retires in two years, George Allen will run for the seat. This also explains why Allen folded so easily–forgoing a recount.

    And here a note for those who think that the Democrats can make gains in the Senate in 2008: Don’t expect much; many of those seats are “owned” by “the Confederacy Party.”

  • (Perhaps Rove’s problem was trying to do all his political math in base hate.)

    Rove’s political calculations have been based on energizing and getting out his base rather than winning votes from the middle. The last election was, I think, the result of a combination of four things: a slim repudiation of that sort of politics, plus disgust at Republican scandals and corruption, plus a repudiation of the ideas pushed by Rove and Cheney, and also a repudiation of the incompetence of Bush and the vast majority of his appointees. The Iraq war is front and center in the news and exemplifies at least three of the four problems.

    In a reality-based administration, Rove would be out on his ear within another week. However, I’m sure Bush will stick with Rove and Cheney: he likes them, and likes their style of politics. (He was his father’s hatchet man, after all, and he is at heart a vicious and vindictive bully – see http://qando.net/archives/BushRugby1.bmp .) All three of them just got magically transformed to about the lamest duck status that we’ve ever seen. The Democrats will feel quite a bit of pressure to accomplish some things and to be bipartisan and cooperative rather than partisan and vindictive, so if Bush were to pull a Clintonian reversal and become newly cooperative and support some popular policies, I think he could end his presidency on a positive note, as much as I’d hate to see that happen. For that to happen, he’d have to break his ties to Rove and Cheney (they wouldn’t have to be fired, just ignored, and more pragmatic advisers would have to be brought in and listened to.) Fortunately, I see no chance of that happening, so I’m predicting melt-down and ineffectiveness for the last two years of the Bush administration.

  • Rove argued that the GOP was this close to winning the whole cycle.

    Clearly, THE math is selective math. After Rove made his argument about how Republicans were just this close, he should have been asked about the 2004 victory margins that were washed away in the 28 (so far) districts that flipped from Republican to Democrat. The Times has a nice graphic that illustrates that all but one of these districts had a 9 percentage point or greater Republican advantage in ’04.

    You’d think a genius would figure out a way not to squander all those leads and then some.

  • Rove is an artist who creates reality by weaving elements into simplistic themes which he then sells as a reality in slogans. In essense Rove has a typewriter with only about eight keys.
    Cut and run vs. stay the course
    Fight them there so we don’t fight them here.
    flip flop sanctity of life .. of a man and a woman
    Democratic tax increase

    His content is pure propaganda and has little capacity to relate to those who don’t already believe the dogma..
    Rove is doomed to play only to an ever shrinking house due to the limitations of his method…

  • A shift of 77,611 votes would have given Republicans control of the House, according to Bush’s political team. And a shift of 2,847 votes in Montana, or 7,217 votes in Virginia, or 41,537 votes in Missouri would have given a Republicans control of the Senate.

    Yeah Karl, but guess what? It DIDN’T happen so fuck you and THE math you were counting on!!!!

  • Considering all the House races Democrats lost by an eyelash, I’d bet that a strategically placed shift of 77,000 votes in a different direction would have given us something like a 50-seat majority.

    Add in that Democrats won the national Senate vote by something like 13 points, and that silver lining for the politics of divide, deceive and destroy gets even dimmer.

    Tom is correct that we have to keep our feet on the throats of the scorched-earth right until the Republicans as a party begin to turn away from their theoligarchic impulses and, at the least, start behaving like principled conservatives again. Progress toward a filibuster-proof Senate majority in two years, and taking back the White House, might get us there.

  • Bummer for Karl that you go into elections with the math you have, not the math you might want or wish to have at a later time.

    Rove counts on a generally uninspired voting populace that can be turned to one’s favor by manipulating a few key base constituencies. He gravely underestimated how much he pissed off the rest of us and had us chomping at the bit to get Rove’s buddies out of office. Thanks for your brilliant strategies, Karl, that unwittingly inspired a counter-revolution.

  • ***I said THE math.***
    ———————————–Mr. half-Limbaugh, half rubber chicken.

    What you have to understand is that this “math” is very protolithic (a bit Cheneyesque), partially drug-induced (that’s where the Limbaugh factor comes in), and has a tendency to bounce while smelling to high heaven of rotten eggs (the chicken equation). If you take the denominator of a Chevy Vega that’s stuck in a day-long traffic jam, multiply by the square root of a well-beaten and somewhat-ridden dead horse, add an over-ripe boysenberry while simultaneously factoring the quantum ethanol-count of a lemming’s urine exactly four hours and seventeen minutes after it has consumed 35 milliliters of Everclear—then you get RoveMath, which is absolutely worthless.

    Karl Rove is no longer “the last remaining sentient creature on the planet who didn’t know this”—thus proving that a feral cat can be taught a new trick….

  • Second try on that damned fruit…

    “Rove takes solace in Lieberman’s win?” — CB

    Well, it’s tit-for-tat; Rove was the frst to call Lieberman — offering comfort (and sweetly whispered promises, no doubt)– when Lieberman lost the Dem primary. I’m sure Lieberman returned the call when he won the general (…words of love, oh… whispered soft and clear — The Beatles), to reassure Rove.

    “That’s the goal for 2008: 27 at-risk Republican Senators […]” Tom Cleaver, @1

    Dahlink… You (and the rest of us) need to think in terms of 2012; ’08 should be easy pickings (relatively speaking), unless we *really* fubar in the next 2 yrs. The only reason ’08 will be important is because it coincides with the Presidential elections. The ’12 will be the real “proof of the pudding”

    “Here’s a prognostication: When Sen. John Warner of Virginia retires in two years, George Allen will run for the seat. This also explains why Allen folded so easily–forgoing a recount.” — slip kid, @6

    Sweetie… Bite your tongue 🙂 We’re looking to replace one Warner (John) with another (Mark), now that Mark’s out of the Presidential run. If Mark Warner announces his candidacy (and, so far, he’s not said “no”, the way he did on the Presidential run), Allen won’t even run, because Mark is a *shoo in*. (John) Warner himself is more likely to endorse (Mark) Warner than the Macacawitz; he toed the party line this past campaign cycle but, even so, what he said about his fellow-soldier Webb had been warmer than his “endorsement” of Macaca.

    Allen folded, because you can’t buck 7thou+ votes (in a single state) going against you. And, with 50% of the post-poll canvas done, the few discrepancies were moving in *Webb’s* direction. While, the longer the light shone on the issue, the more likely it was that “election day irregularities” would have surfaced and landed Allen in jail, before they landed him in the Senate. Allen conceded because all his — erst-while — buddies in NRC *sat on him*

    “Bummer for Karl that you go into elections with the math you have, not the math you might want or wish to have at a later time” — petorado, @14

    Petorado, I’ll say the same to you as I did to Dale (on another thread) — Mac keyboards are damn expensive

    Regarding Karl and “the math”: I think he’s like me — more verbal than mathematical (“cut and run” *does* have a ring to it, no? As do all the other one-liners, as quoted by Kali, @10). People like us hope that there is *the* math, because we’re so bad at the real stuff…

  • One thing Kevin Drum left out of his analysis:

    • In 1986, during Reagan’s sixth year, the Republican’s lost a total of 5 seats in the House.

    • In 1996, during Clinton’s sixth year, the Democrats gained 5 seats in the House.

    So in the last three decades, the average sixth year mid-term net loss for the president’s party in the House was 0 seats.

  • Oops. I meant 1998 for Clinton (above). Also Kevin said 5 seats but I think it might have been 4. Have to look that up.

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